Tradthot E-GIRL DRAMA?! Do Modern Women Deserve Trad Men?! She IS The Table?! | Dating Talk #255

Date: 2025-08-11

Duration: 8h 49m

Guests

Brian Atlas

JJamie (Teacher)>

Identified Speakers

SPEAKER_03Zena(guest)

SPEAKER_04Ellie / Jamie(guest)

SPEAKER_05Heidi(guest)

SPEAKER_06Kamaya(guest)

SPEAKER_09Brian Atlas(host)

SPEAKER_10Paulina(guest)

SPEAKER_12Mars (USC)(guest)

SPEAKER_13Elizabeth(guest)

Key Moments

IntroAll 8 guests introduce themselves

Key MomentHeidi reveals situationship partner is a male sex worker

Key MomentRinggate e-girl drama: Sarah engagement ring / Pearl Davis / Emily / Morgan controversy

Key MomentHeidi vs Brian: 'Are you looking for a boyfriend or an ATM?'

OtherPaulina leaves the show at ~472 min

Topics Discussed

Guest Introductions

8 guests including Heidi (situationship with male sex worker) and Jamie (DV survivor).

Heidi Male Sex Worker Reveal

Heidi's situationship partner is a male sex worker.

Ringgate E-Girl Drama

Sarah engagement ring / Pearl Davis / Emily / Morgan Twitter drama react.

Farting in Relationships

Brian's strong anti-farting stance in relationships.

Equal Partnership vs Providing

Heidi vs Brian: 'Are you looking for a boyfriend or an ATM?'

Paper Abortion Debate

Legal paternal surrender / male reproductive rights debate.

Body Count Round

Heidi 1, Elizabeth 2, Kamaya 5, Mars under 25, Ellie 0, Zena 10-25, Jamie 8.

Transcript

Page 5 of 9

Brian Atlasmy rating of you is not going to change because you gave me a 5.5. >> It's going to remain the exact same as like I assess it even before that. I'm not going to like >> do this vindictive thing or whatever. Okay. Um I mean it would be kind of nice

Heidito go around this way. >> Yeah. Dude, are you doing objective or like personal type based? >> Yeah, because I did objective and personal. >> It would be a subjective rating. I'm just asking clarifying >> cuz I don't think >> Yeah, there's no objective. You know

Brian Atlaswhat I mean? >> It would be subjective because it would be my like another guy could give you a different rating. >> Well, I just wasn't sure if you were doing like practical beauty standard or you're just personal type. >> Yeah, that's what I meant. Like just to

Brian Atlasclarify, >> there's a difference. >> Yeah, there I'd say I would say there was a there is a bit of a difference. Um but uh yeah, I'll give you my rating. Okay. Um,

Brian Atlaslet's see. Um, and you guys are wearing makeup, so I'm going to like in the brain remove your makeup in my head. >> My cellar water and and

Brian Atlas>> you're consistent. I can appreciate it. >> All right. Uh 6 five 5.5

Brian Atlas6 maybe 6.5 7.5

Heidi>> three >> okay

Brian Atlas[Laughter] >> you know what uh hold on 2.5 Five. >> Wait, >> 2.5 for both of you. Uh,

Mars (USC)>> are you blind? >> Did that not feel racially? >> Five. >> Five.5. >> Let us know if you agree in the comments. >> Does that not feel racially motivated? >> I

Brian Atlas>> Well, I think he's into Asian girls. >> I like I like white women. Hold on. Okay. Okay. That >> makes white women, Latino women, Asian women,

Brian Atlas>> occasionally black women, >> Native Americans. I'll date I've dated a Native American. >> Oh, okay. >> She was a Cherokee. >> Was she? >> Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

Kamaya>> I don't I'll date different races. >> Wait, what's your basis for giving us the rating? Like, what are you looking at? And what do you >> uh face and body? >> Yeah.

Mars (USC)Can I ask you since you couldn't find a particular person who exemplified this, but describe your 10 of a woman? I'm just curious. >> Oh, uh, young Adriana Lima. I guess she's pretty good. >> Yeah, duh. >> Yeah.

SPEAKER_11>> Okay. >> Young Megan Fox. >> So, brunette, but young >> must be young. >> Beauty is 2.5. >> Yeah. So you rate yourself, you rated

Mars (USC)yourself a six, was it? You rated yourself a five. >> Five. So that put me pretty average. So in some dimensions, in some dimensions, >> you believe that you are more attractive

Mars (USC)than what half of the women here or I don't remember your exact ratings, but >> um >> just two >> two >> and the same level of half.

HeidiHe said like the same level as half cuz he rated like half the girls fives, five and a half. >> I don't even remember the ratings I gave, but I think most of the women I rated. >> Well, he gave Ellie a Ellie average.

Brian AtlasEllie a >> seven.5. I gave you six 6.5 >> 5.5. >> Yeah. >> Six. >> 2.5.

Brian Atlas>> 2.5 5.5 I think. Yeah. >> So I rate most of the women like on lookspace is more attractive than me, I guess. >> Yeah. >> Interesting. >> What's interesting about it?

Mars (USC)>> I just I think >> you're not into interesting to hear your rating. >> I'm not a black >> No. No. I said it feels like you're not into black women. >> I mean, I'm just I'm Well, I'm just

Mars (USC)>> There's beautiful black women, but >> No, I No, I was I wasn't trying to assume. I was just saying what it looked like. I'm not assuming. You guys were >> I have questions that I don't want to sound like a pick me. I'm just curious

Mars (USC)like to understand how your brain works. >> So, you rated her the highest. >> Sure. >> Um, you know what? >> What the [ __ ] LA chill. >> I'm sorry. I'm just putting on the spot. My bad. >> Okay.

Mars (USC)>> I won't even like drag you into this. Um, actually, I'm going to >> just be >> How, you know, without being whatever, just speak freely. I think we all consent free speech.

Mars (USC)>> Yeah. What's the question? Um, how can she be a 10 since she's your your highest rating? You're seven, 7.5. What would make her go higher in your eyes? I'm just curious.

Mars (USC)>> How can Ellie become Wait, >> you rated her the highest decision. How could she looks looks Max for for you? >> She got to fix her posture a little bit.

Brian Atlas>> She likes >> Well, I'm like a 4chan posture. >> Resting [ __ ] face. >> She's got she's got uh No, I mean, >> he's into that. There's there's really

Mars (USC)not a whole bunch that I think people can do to improve. >> You think like you got it or you don't? Like you're born with it type enhance. >> Well, I mean, >> well, I feel like he's made it clear he's not into

Paulina>> Exactly. >> to what? >> Like enhancements like >> Oh, no. That would lower than she would have a certain way. But >> if Ellie had fake boobs, she'd go down in >> Yeah. >> rating.

Brian Atlas>> Right. Right. Right. She had some giant fake cans down, she'd be less attractive. >> Can we get like a chest plate in here? I feel like that's a good prop. >> A chest plate. >> A chest plate. What's that? >> A chest plate. Like those like huge

Brian Atlassilicone boobs. >> Oh, the the Yeah, I know what you're talking about. Uh I mean, what can somebody do to look better? So many things. Somebody better diet, your you know, workout regime.

Ellie / Jamie>> You got what you got. It was just another extension of like disingenuity like with the makeup thing and then like I don't know plastic surgery. So I don't think anybody can really do that except

Ellie / Jamiefor I guess if he's really looking inward on somebody then can't really change much. >> Yeah, I think Ellie's kind of like her stats are kind of maxed out.

Ellie / Jamie>> Oh, this is the best it'll ever be. >> Well, I think you're beautiful. >> She's going to crawl. into the camera. >> She's good.

Brian Atlas>> I mean, there's like probably there there's in terms of making yourself more attractive beyond just looks though. Yeah, there's things that people can do. >> Oh, for sure. >> Mhm. >> Like, which I guess gets us into our next topic. Uh, you had an issue with

Brian Atlasbowing. >> Bowing >> or who was that? Somebody had an issue with the bow. >> Bowing. Who has what kind of bowing? >> Oh, right. So, um, Nick, can you pull up the bow video? We'll get into that. >> The Japanese do it.

Brian Atlas>> I like their culture. Hold on for just a moment. Just one sec. It was >> had the issue. I think I agreed. >> Oh, maybe it was an agreement. Maybe I uh you said you want to talk about

Ellie / Jamiebeauty standards, feminism, the bow. >> Oh, so you're on board with the bow. >> I am on board with >> Oh, okay. I thought you were disagree. I mean, you know, or even like like a

Brian Atlascurtsy or whatever respectful, you know, it's it's uh you you said that you're in line with most of what I say only some of my stances are goofy. >> Yeah.

Ellie / Jamie>> Which are the goofy stances? >> Oh, man. Probably uh >> what >> probably your BLM movement here. >> Big labia matter. >> That one caught me off guard. If you

Ellie / Jamiehave big labia and you've ever tried to trim those bad boys or wax them, I don't think that you'd probably be like, "Yeah, big labia." >> Okay. Are So, you're you're saying you

SPEAKER_14you're rocking. >> I think it's goofy. >> Wait, what do you mean? >> I I think that stance is goofy. Yeah, big labia matter. >> They do. >> I mean, yeah, they matter. All labia matter,

Brian Atlas>> but I mean, if that's your preference, then rock on, man. I mean, I'll date like innies are great, too. >> But it won't be your first pick. >> It's like I have a preference for

Mars (USC)Audi's. >> But it's not a dealbreaker. You You love that. >> I don't know. I feel that men don't typically say such bold things. So, I like that you said that. >> Well, most men will say like they either

Brian Atlashave misconceptions about it like, "Oh, she's been like if a girl has an Audi, she's [ __ ] a bunch of dudes. That's not how anatomy works." And then yeah, that's just not how that works. And then

Brian Atlasum I don't know. Me personally, >> you okay, Felicity? >> Yeah. >> You need you need some applesauce. >> Can we get No, I'm just kidding. I'm

Brian Atlasgiving you a hard time, Felicity. Uh >> Felicity is a loud breather. >> Sometimes I think she's like, "Fuck this." Um >> I have no idea.

Elizabeth>> Yeah, I think uh yeah, I don't know. Like women have genitalia preference. Like they want a guy with a >> package. >> No, that's not true. >> Yet they have to know how to use it.

Brian Atlas>> Small or big. >> I mean, I guess that you have a preference then women have a preference against small pens. >> You know, some girls are into that. >> Small pens.

Mars (USC)>> Some Yeah. I I definitely have some female friends who like um dare I say can't handle Oh, sorry. Um, I I have

Mars (USC)female friends who have boyfriends who are below average and they're perfectly happy because it's about the motion of the ocean in their relationship. >> I don't relate to that, but to each their own.

Brian Atlas>> Different strokes for different folks, literally. [Laughter] >> Uh, anyways, I mean, there's not really too much to debate there on the labia thing, but >> yeah. No, I mean I just said I just

SPEAKER_14>> Are you trying to get a laboplasty? Is that what >> No, >> no. >> I just thought that it was it was a goofy view. The question was goofy labia matter, huh? >> The preference itself, I think.

Ellie / Jamie>> Why? Why is that goofy? Why is it goofy? >> Oh, here. Let me let me get back into the frame of mind that I was when I wrote this. >> Yeah. I don't think it's going to get there. I just think it was silly. I

Ellie / Jamiethink >> Oh, okay. I think you did it because BLM also stands for something else. >> Yeah. >> And you were trying to capitalize on the moment. >> I was trying to capitalize on the BLM.

Brian AtlasYeah. The the Black Lives Matter movement, of course. Um, no, I mean, I wouldn't It It's a play on words a little bit, but I definitely have always been an advocate for women with large labia.

Brian Atlas>> And I also have I have a dating preference. >> Oh my god. >> Is that like in your Tinder bio? For a period of time, I did write on Hinge. Uh I don't know, you know, there's the prompts. It's like you should definitely message me if

Brian Atlas>> if you have a big >> If you have a giant labia, >> if you have a Guinness World Record, >> record breaking. >> I've been labia catfished before though, which is frustrating.

Brian Atlas>> You know, I don't think I've ever heard a sentence like that. This is places for me. >> Yeah. No, like, you know, but how about this girls? Have you ever had a dude who

Mars (USC)said he had a big dick, didn't have a big dick? >> I'll be honest, I rarely have the conversation about genitalia prior to the action. And I've

Mars (USC)been disappointed before. Like, I thought it was going to be bigger, but it's not like, oh, he said it was big and then it wasn't. It was like, oh, I had I had hopes that it would be bigger and >> I was disappointed.

Mars (USC)Did you not talk to him after the disappointment? >> What am I supposed to say? Cuz it's like >> like was it the one time thing because of the small peep? >> I don't know cuz that's the thing like I' I've definitely like been interested

Mars (USC)in guys before who you know I'll be honest had small penises and um it's just unfortunate when you cuz it's not their fault. you know, they were born

Mars (USC)that way, but sex is a big deal to me in a relationship. And, you know, let's say they're not very proficient in other things such as foreplay. It's like, what are you even meant to do at that point? You know,

Mars (USC)>> teach him. >> Why am I your [ __ ] teacher, though? >> I mean, >> I would I don't know. I would rather them know what they're doing already, to be honest. >> It's an honest answer, though. I mean,

Paulinait's an honest answer. I think most women probably feel that way. Um, but yeah. How did we get here? >> How did we get here? >> My brother talking about

Paulinapreferences. >> No comment on the meat curtains. That's it. >> Not the meat. >> No comment. Have you been shamed? Have you Somebody shamed you before. >> No, I just >> It's not proper conversation for any

Brian Atlas>> Oh, but you were you were saying how you don't you're not having that conversation often, right? >> And I I think that's true. probably most guys, but I I have heard stories about how some guys will say that they're

Brian Atlaspacking and the girls like, "No, you wasn't. No, not packing." >> Some guys are overconfident. >> Some guys mislead and I've been catfished >> in the labia world >> in the They say they got an Audi, not an Audi.

Mars (USC)>> It was an oversell. >> Maybe they've been gaslit. >> No, probably not. >> I don't know. cuz I would I would say to generalize I I would say that most men prefer innies. Would you agree with that?

Mars (USC)>> I would agree with that. >> Since hence your movement >> so maybe she didn't even know >> I'm a maverick. I'm a maverick. >> I'm spearheading this movement.

Mars (USC)>> It's beautiful. >> Are you on board? Are you wanting to join the movement? >> You know, I support your movement. I have >> Yes. In every regard. Um, I have no comment, but I support you. >> Thank you. Appreciate it.

Brian Atlas>> Yeah. >> Anyways, uh, moving on from that topic. Where were we? We were going to get into what >> bow. >> Oh, the bow. Thank you, Nick, for the reminder. >> The curtsy. >> Nick, can you close one of those doors? Uh, let's go ahead pull up the bow

Brian Atlasvideo. >> Uh, so this is a video uh I took of my ex-girlfriend. This is And I show this to my new girls I'm dating so they know

Brian Atlasmy expectations. It's like a tutorial. I show you got to you got to kind of, you know, get the girls on the right track. >> So, this is a tutorial video. I show them. All right. Go ahead.

Brian Atlas>> Boom. Bow. Immediately, come through the door. Huge bow. Respectful bow. And then, look, this was after a long podcast. I was tired.

Brian AtlasGet to laundry. Get the the laundry done. She has my dinner ready. You got to scamper across the apartment. Open cracks open my beer for me. Stirs

Brian Atlasmy noodles. She didn't stir them good enough, so I had to scold her and tell her to do it better. And then um but >> she actually speaking Japanese the whole time. Is that part of the requirements? >> Uh she was actually Chinese. That's kind

Brian Atlasof racist. Please don't cancel me. Please don't cancel me. I'm so sorry. >> And uh play play the bow part one more time. The bow is the most important. Forget whatever the clothes, whatever. dinner, whatever. Boom. Huge bow. You

Brian Atlassee the depth. You see the hand, the submissive hand posture. That's >> that's my expectation. A relationship. Every time I come home, >> I want to bow. Greet me at the door with

Ellie / Jamiea bow, a little respect, a cooked dinner. >> I'm sorry. I just don't think that video was a prime example. >> What? What do you mean? Well, she didn't

Ellie / Jamiemama bird your beer and your noodles into your mouth. So, I'm thinking she's falling short. >> Mama birth. So, it's in her mouth and she >> Yeah. >> Have you done that with someone? >> No. I just think that's what you should

Brian Atlascome to expect. >> I don't know. >> It's kind of gross to be It's a >> I mean, after a long day at work, you want to be chewing your food. >> Really? >> That is a You rais a fair point there,

Brian AtlasEllie. Um, it's that's very consider considerate of you, but you know, I am I can sufficiently chew my food. >> You're better than most

Brian Atlas>> mastication. >> We can see why we can see Ellie is the based housewife over here. Totally mama and birding food. >> Do you want a girlfriend or an assistant? >> What? What do you mean?

Heidi>> Because I felt like that video showed her being your assistant, not a girlfriend. Yeah, I'm I'm happy to engage with that. Um, so >> ex-girlfriend, >> I dumped her. Yeah, I dumped her. Um, >> because she wasn't a good enough

Brian Atlasassistant. >> Correct. Gotcha. >> Uh, do you want a guy to pay for the first date when you go on a date? >> I always offer to pay. >> But if a guy paid like if a guy took you

Brian Atlasup on that offer, like I want a man cuz women say I offer as a token gesture but don't actually expect or want the guy to pay anyways. And it would be an issue if the guy took you up on your token fake

Heidigesture. >> If they took me up on it, it would just show me more about his perception and his viewpoint. >> What's his perception and viewpoint if he takes you up on the words that came out of your mouth?

Heidi>> Like it's like, okay, you don't want to pay for a first date. Like, >> and that says what? >> Says you're broke. Not not necessarily, but in other words,

Heidiyou're saying >> if you asked me out, why would you not pay? I'm doing the favor of coming to the dinner. >> How of have you ever asked a guy out for a first date? >> Yeah.

Brian Atlas>> Of all the first dates you've been on, how many like what's the percentage breakdown? >> Um, >> how many f Let's start with this. How many first dates have you been on? >> Maybe like 15. >> 15. Okay.

Brian Atlas>> Yeah. Uh, how many of those did you Were you the one asking the guy out? >> Maybe like two. >> Two. Okay. So, whoever asked. So, your

Brian Atlaspoint about well, whoever asks should pay. It would make sense if men and women were asking each other out at equivalent rates, but they clearly aren't. Uh, men are overwhelmingly the ones that have to initiate. Most men,

Brian Atlasuh, average men are definitely not getting the experience of ever being asked out, period. Maybe like super attractive guys have women in their DMs so forth. But I guess so you do want men

Brian Atlasto pay for first dates. It sounds like >> I think it's a sign of respect. >> Okay. And it's a sign of respect when a woman

Brian Atlasbows, cooks me dinner, and takes care of the household while I'm out working. >> I think it can also be labeled as an assistant.

Brian Atlas>> Okay. Well, so would you would you also label it as like I'm looking for a mom? >> Like if I want a woman to do my laundry, to cook for me, those sorts of things. Am I So I've heard some women make a

Heidicriticism of you're looking for a mom, not a girlfriend, not a wife. >> Yeah, sometimes that can be true, too. >> Okay. >> And sometimes a lot of those guys have mommy issues, which is why girls are

Brian Atlaslike, "Oh, you're looking for a mom." >> Perfect question for you. When it comes to what you're looking for in a guy, you said you want a guy to pay for dates. Would you want a guy to say I want them to pay for dates? The first date, it's a

Brian Atlassign of respect, but do I expect them to pay for all the dates we go on? No. >> Have you ever The guy who was the s worker, would he pay for the dates? >> Yeah, but I've also paid >> sometimes, but mostly he paid.

Brian Atlas>> Yeah. >> Okay. So, it's still not quite equal. Um, do you want a guy who's a protector? >> Yes. >> Ah, okay. You want a father figure. You just want a dad. You want a You want a father.

Brian Atlas>> I have a father. I have actually. >> But women who say men who want women to cook, to clean, to do their laundry, take care of household chores. They're not looking for a wife. They're not

Brian Atlaslooking for a girlfriend. They're looking for a mom. Well, I then I can just turn this around on women and say, 'Well, as a woman, if you want a guy to provide and protect, you're just looking for a dad, not a

Heidiboyfriend, not a husband. So, why is it that >> should I feel unsafe in my own home? Should I feel unsafe walking down the street? If I have a guy, shouldn't he not protect me?

Brian Atlas>> I don't think that there's anything wrong with wanting those things and wanting a guy who can and will protect you. But what I'm saying is >> you guys want men to adhere to our traditional gender roles, >> right?

Brian Atlas>> But you don't want to adhere to yours. So when it comes to the expectation on men and men's duties in relationship, it's might as well be the 1950s for men still have to provide, still have to

Brian Atlasprotect. But when it comes to women's roles, it's all negotiable. Totally negotiable. >> Well, I think a man can a man can cook, a man can clean, >> a woman can protect herself, a woman can own a gun. Yeah,

Heidi>> I >> a woman can make money and provide for herself. >> Yes, I agree. I can make money. I provide for myself. I do protect myself. >> So, why do you want a provider and a protector if you can do it yourself? >> I don't think it's more that I want

Heidithat. I think if I'm going to be in a relationship with somebody >> I shouldn't have to go without being protected. Why would my partner not want to protect me? >> I love it. So when I'm in a relationship, I want a woman who can

Brian Atlascook and clean and take care of the household for me. Why should I not feel nurtured in that way? >> I think it's more of like

Brian Atlasthat's all you expect out of it. >> I I expect a lot, trust me, from women. >> Yeah, I can tell. >> Wait, so is that a bad thing or a good thing? Explain. Is it bad that I want I

Heidihave high expectations or is it >> am I asking too much? What do you >> I don't think you're asking too much, but I think it's just like the type of person like I I expect more like

Heidiemotional things out of a relationship, not >> superficial. It's not about the money. It's not about the protection. It's more about like the connection we have. >> But you said if the guy doesn't pay for the first date, there won't be a second.

Brian Atlas>> Yeah. >> I never said there wouldn't be a second. I just think it shows a sign of respect. Well, I think it wouldn't it also be respectful for the woman to pay for the first date then if it if paying for the first date is just about showing respect

Brian Atlasthen well I guess you would have to make the argument to show mutual respect both people just pay for their own food. >> That's what I usually offer. It's like we can >> But hold on. But earlier you said if the

Brian Atlasguy asks me out he should pay and then the offer is sounds token to me. >> I mean if he's like yeah let's go halves. I'm like, "Okay." And then it's like,

Brian Atlas>> "Yeah, but is it negative brownie points?" >> Kind of just shows where you're at financially. >> The answer is yes. >> I mean, you do, but it is logically possible. Like, it's logically possible

Heidia billionaire could go on a date with a broke woman and be like, "We're going to split the bill." Like, it's that's logically possible, right? >> But then I kind of feel like he's like that I'm not worth his time. Like, he's

Heidibasically telling me you're not worth my money. like you're not worth being spent on, but he's spending his time on you and he probably spends his time with multiple other women.

Ellie / Jamie>> I mean, that's a huge projection and a huge assumption. I don't know. I finding a quality date, I guess, would be step one >> in all that. I mean, a first date should

Ellie / Jamiebe rel something relatively simple. I think my first date with my now husband was like, "Hey, come walk my dog with me." you know, and we got to know each

Ellie / Jamieother like that. And I mean, eventually, like, as dates went on, Yeah. know, he he he paid. >> I mean, Brian's totally right. It seems

Paulinalike even feminists put men at the default of being traditional always. It's always the desire and the want to take those >> go both ways. I understand that. >> Right. But then it doesn't. But then

Paulinawomen don't want to take on a traditional role, which is what he wants is pretty traditional. Women kind of tending to the household and catering to their men. That's what we've always done throughout history. >> Raising the kids. >> Raising kids. I have a question.

Mars (USC)>> Not that complicated. >> So I kind of fall into more traditional mentalities when I date. Um I don't believe in that 50/50 [ __ ] to be honest. I think a man should be a provider and protector. And I do I I do agree and

Mars (USC)align with a lot of what you're saying that a woman should provide to a household. But at the same time, I also consider myself a businesswoman. And I, you know, I'm working so much. I'm a

Mars (USC)full-time student on top of that. Would you be satisfied if you and your partner were in a situation where you could pay for a chef, you could pay for a driver, you could pay for, you know, people who

Mars (USC)are going to help with those housework tasks so she can focus on her passions and, you know, loving you in a different way. Are you okay with that? >> What's her passion? >> Well, let's say that she, you know, runs

Mars (USC)her own business. Let's say she's, you know, an actress. Let's say she's a cont. She does what you do and she has her own brand. Um, are you okay with that or you just do you want more just support in your partner?

Brian Atlas>> Well, I suppose it depends at what stage do you meet them? So, it's once a woman's already like deeply involved in something.

Brian Atlas>> Uh, most men are probably going to have to make a concession on like I mean it varies, but if she's not

Brian Atlasalready in that dimension >> Mhm. then that's not the kind of dynamic I'd want. >> Okay. >> But you're asking from my own personal perspective. So my own personal

Brian Atlasperspective, >> I'm doing fairly well. I could fully cover everything. She doesn't have to work ever. >> Mhm.

Mars (USC)>> Uh so your question is pay for like a cook to come in. >> Yeah. And I didn't even mean it in the sense that like, okay, now that you have people who are fulfilling these roles, she's just [ __ ] watching Love Island all day and doing nothing. That's not

Mars (USC)what I meant. I meant more >> you got to keep her busy. >> Yeah. I meant that let's say that she she has other things that occupy her time that either, you know, fulfill her soul or bring brings in money or

Mars (USC)whatever. Would you be okay if she spent her time doing that rather than cooking or cleaning or things that could be fulfilled? Because at the end of it all, yes, I understand that those things are important to you, but don't you see that

Mars (USC)anybody can fulfill that? And in your partner, in your wife, you obviously like her for more than just, oh, she's proficient at these tasks. You think she's attractive and you like her personality ideally, you know?

Brian Atlas>> Well, I I would say that there there does become a point, a level of wealth where offsetting some of the these tasks to somebody else, >> like it's it would almost be a

Brian Atlasno-brainer, right? Like if I was a billionaire, I don't think I would be like, "Okay, you're going to clean the house." Like if I was a billionaire, I'm like, "You don't need to clean the house." Although there perhaps there's some circumstance where like the cleaner

Brian Atlasis busy today. You would like her to >> if there is something that needs to be cleaned and the cleaner I mean, if you're a billionaire, you probably have like in like staff that lives in your house. So, >> right, >> it's it's hard to like put yourself in

Brian Atlasthat paradigm of like that level of wealth. So, I think that level of wealth, of course, you're you're probably looking to your partner not to take on the like mundane house, but you

Brian Atlasare looking you're still going to look to her to defer to you, to defer to your leadership, to be submissive, >> okay? >> But that's probably not going to

Brian Atlasnecessarily entail entail like, okay, now you're going to like do housework that I can like pawn off to a third party. you can do it for a couple hundred bucks or have like in have staff

Brian Atlasthat's just paid salary or something. >> Mhm. >> Uh so but I don't know there there's like it depends to what degree you have third parties involved in your life.

Brian Atlas>> Uhhuh. >> So I don't know. Um I might have her go get me something on the other side of the house or something. I don't know.

Mars (USC)>> Yeah. Like I guess my question is are you so traditional to the sense that you don't even want your wife to have a job? You want her full-time job to be taking care of your kids and you know making sure the house is

Brian Atlas>> That's a good point. That's I mean so when we do have kids though >> because I was thinking more so prior to kids but when we do have kids >> uh we can have assistance but I want I don't want to uh

Brian Atlas>> pawn your kids off >> pond the kids off >> totally >> to the point where she then pursues some sort of career >> I'd want her being the like full primary she can have assistance like if she needs somebody there to help out with

Brian Atlasstuff but I'd still want her being the primary role when it comes to raising the children. Yeah. >> Uh so in that sense um if I was so wealthy to the point, yeah, okay, the

Brian Atlascleaning, yeah, we can have somebody else take care of that. But when it comes to the kids, then all of your attention that would perhaps if I earned less would have gone to these more mundane tasks, cleaning, cooking, we can

Brian Atlaswe can have a chef. >> We can have a clean like people clean come in and clean, >> but you're going to then dedicate more of your time to the kids. >> Yeah. I I think that's a totally valid

Mars (USC)claim, honestly. And I would just like to ask, so from what I understand, you would like your wife to be the primary caretaker of your children. I'm just curious, how involved, obviously, you would be the bread winner in this

Brian Atlassituation that we're talking about right now. How involved would you like to be in raising your kids? >> I mean, definitely involved, but it it depends to what degree I'm working or if

Brian AtlasI'm retired, >> right? So, and I mean I could give you my own personal, you know, stance on >> my own or my projection of where I think I'll be in a couple years or what I

Brian Atlasthink like >> a guy who it depends again on the level of income and wealth. That's going to factor in a lot in terms of your free time. >> Currently, I'm super busy with my work. I would still spend a good amount of

Brian Atlastime with children, but it would not be anywhere near approaching the amount of time that uh my girlfriend or whatever could be taking care of the kids, >> right? >> So,

Brian Atlasuh but if I was retired, I'd spend a lot of time with the kids. >> Mhm. >> It's a value of your >> like if I retired early. Yeah. If I retired at 40 or something. >> Gotcha. >> I would also be spending a lot of times with the kids

SPEAKER_14>> because, you know, you got to raise some like little warriors or whatever. I want to raise some >> warriors. Warriors. Uh, so I don't know. >> And they're years that you don't get back, too. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I think it's I think it's

Brian Atlasprecious. I think family is precious. >> But there will probably be a period of time. I would say at least when the kids are young, probably like it's hard to project, you know, how things, you know,

Brian Atlaswho knows what can happen. Business can change, whatever, whatever. But probably the first couple years probably not. I mean, she's gonna be primarily handling that.

Brian Atlas>> If I retire early, which I think is kind of what I want to do, but we'll see. Um, >> then I'll definitely be more involved as they, you know, five, six, seven, eight, so forth. >> Yeah.

Brian Atlas>> Cool. >> Yeah. What What about this though? Uh, uh, she changes all the diapers. What do you guys think about that? >> That's [ __ ] >> Why is that [ __ ]

Brian AtlasUm, so I'm actually expecting Congratulations. >> Oh, okay. Pers. >> Yeah, I'm >> How how do you know anything? Do you know the gender? >> I'm 6 weeks, so I'll find out uh in two

Kamayaweeks. >> That's so exciting. I wish you so much success in that. I hope it's seamless. >> Thank you. >> Yeah, actually during PA school, but

Kamayayeah. Um, so, um, I would expect my partner to do as much as I do. Um, I think especially in the in the first few

Kamayamonths, um, your sleep is very precious to you. So, if I'm tired, um, my fiance will take over. If he's tired, I'll take over. I don't think it has anything to do with gender. It's just what needs to be done for the kid. You just need to do

Brian Atlasit. >> Yeah. You're a team in that sense. So, I'm like, >> I mean, if if she's not working and I'm taking care of everything and I have work I have to go do, >> that's a different situation, though. I think that's totally valid. But, let's

Mars (USC)say they're both working, you know what I mean? They're both like just getting by. Then it's like obviously both members, I would say, have to put in a relatively equal support in taking care of your child, you know, cuz the circumstances.

Kamaya>> Are you going to be working? >> Uh, so I'm actually graduating at the end of this year. I take my exam in January and then I won't be working for a few months. So, >> you're you're going to be a physician assistant, right? >> Yes. Mhm. >> Wait, you're graduating from PA school

Kamayaor is that what's that called? >> PA school. Yep. >> Okay, I see. Okay. >> Yeah. >> So, I mean, you want to be a boss babe >> basically. >> Um, yeah. I I chose PA specifically because I knew I wanted to have more of

Kamayaa work life balance and that would be better than going to medical school for my situation. And so that's kind of I want I wanted to have a more of a family unit than me working all the time. And I

Kamayathink PA education or PA the profession allows you to do that more >> but still be in healthcare. Yeah. >> Good times. >> Yep. >> But I mean at least the kind of dynamic

Brian AtlasI'm looking forward it would be I'm taking care of everything and she doesn't have to work. But the expectation there is she's going to take be taking on more of the burden when it

Paulinacomes to raising the children. Yeah. >> So, and also the household stuff, too. >> But that's the sacrifice of family. >> Yeah. >> I mean, we've gone our whole lives being selfish, right? I've spent 33 years of

Paulinamy life focusing on myself, doing my own thing. And then once you kind of fulfill your purpose, which is creating a family and continuing the legacy, it's a sacrifice. And it's not going to be fun. It's not going to be easy, but that's the purpose of life.

Paulina>> Yeah. That's how I find right now. It's kind of a weird feeling. It's like because your degree doesn't even matter almost. >> Your child now matters. >> But I want to get back to what our conversation that we were having.

Brian Atlas>> Like I'm coming back for you. >> So I guess going back to it though, uh you were saying, "Well, Brian, when we played the bow video, you're like you you seem to have some objections to that

Brian Atlassort of thing." Um I guess I'm still trying to figure out what what's what are the objections. >> I believe in an equal partnership. I

Heidithink it's 100 100 not 5050 >> equal partnership. Okay. So, >> um, what >> like I'm providing just as much as the

Heidiguy. Like I don't expect them to provide >> I work. I don't expect them to financially.

HeidiI mean, I don't expect them to do everything for me. Like, I'm very self-sufficient >> and independent. Like, I don't need that. I don't need to depend on a man

Heidifor that. If they choose to do that, that's fine. But I'm not depending on them. I still expect to be independent. >> Have you ever lived with a guy? >> I've lived with six men at one time.

Brian Atlas>> No, I mean like a boyfriend. Have you lived with a guy that you've been seeing? >> No. >> I don't mean like you had male roommates. I mean like a guy you were dating. >> Although I guess you've never had a

Brian Atlasboyfriend. So, um Okay. If you were if you were in that sort of situation, would you want the guy to take care of the rent or would you go 50/50 on the

Heidirent? >> Um, it depends on I'm totally okay doing 50/50 on rent. >> But if they want to pay full rent, that's totally up to them and their comfortability and their financial

Brian Atlasstability. >> Um, I don't expect it though. >> You don't expect it? >> No. >> But if they wanted to, you wouldn't put up a fight. You wouldn't insist. >> Wait. You said you believe in equal partnership.

Heidi>> Yeah. >> So why would you not then even if the guy was open to paying for everything. Why would you not then go ahead and insist on paying 5050? >> That doesn't mean I wouldn't pay

Heidiutilities or other bills that the house >> No. Let's say he was like, I'm paying for everything. >> Then that just it's more about how you give and receive love. Like for me personally, I give and receive love

Heidithrough gifts and quality time. Like that is my >> thing for how I give and receive love. Everybody has different things for that. There's like five different things. >> But you I thought you believe in equal

Heidipartnership. >> I do. I give and I receive love the same way. >> Okay. But >> so I can spoil my partner just as well as he can spoil me. And I think that's a

Brian Atlasform of love. You're going to How much is rent in LA? $2,000, $3,000, $4,000. How much you pay for rent for your place? >> $1,100. >> Okay. You pay like you have a room in a house or how's it?

Brian Atlas>> Yeah. >> Okay. So, if you guys get your own place, it's probably going to be $2,000, $3,000. If you want a nice place, $4,000. Um, you're going to be spending buying him

Brian Atlas$4,000 worth of gifts. Like if he's paying all the rent, you're going to spend $4,000 a month on gifts for him >> to equalize the equal partnership.

Heidi>> I think there's more that you can give to a person than just financial value like >> Okay. But you're talking about equal partnership. >> Yeah. >> Right. So if if you're having an equal partnership, shouldn't it be like mostly

Heidiequal? >> Yeah. But if they're insisting, why should I have to fight that? >> Shouldn't you insist that it be equal? It's more like their personal

Heidipreference. It depends on the partner I'm with. Not every partner is going to want to pay all of rent or can pay all of rent all the time. Like if they lose their job and they're not able to cover

Brian Atlasrent, I'm willing to step up. It's more about like >> But I mean, why why hasn't this been the case when you've gone on dates? Like you've said overwhelmingly the men pay for the dates.

Brian Atlas>> Because they want to, >> right? Shouldn't if you believe in equal partnership, shouldn't like what do you do like from a bird's eye view? What do

Heidiyou do to equally contribute to the start of a relationship? >> It's more the emotional aspect. >> What What do you mean? >> Like a lot of guys just aren't like there emotionally.

Brian AtlasSo, I'm willing to be there for people emotionally. >> How soon into like immediately >> on the first date? >> I'm very open. You're very open. But so, okay, guy, for

Brian Atlasexample, here would be like some of the burdens or some of the things you might not want to frame it as a burden that guys do early on to develop or build or initiate a relationship. They're going

Brian Atlasto be the ones approaching you. They're going to make the first move. They're going to be the ones uh taking on the burden of initiative, taking on the burden of rejection or potential rejection. They're going to set up the date. They're going to plan the date.

Brian AtlasThey're going to pay for the date. They're going to move things forward. They're probably going to go for the first kiss. They're going to move things forward physically from there. All of that initiative burden falls on the man. Additionally, there's the financial

Brian Atlascomponent that the guy has to pay for dates. So, traditionally, that's what men do early on. What do women do early

Brian Atlason to when it comes to the development of a budding relationship? Um, I think it's more of just like

Heidicontributing values. >> Contributing values >> like I'm not going to go on a date with somebody that I don't share values with. I'm not going to give them the time of day. I'm not going to waste somebody's

Heiditime. I don't just go on dates to for a free dinner. Like a lot of girls just do that. Like I'm not that type of person. So I think you're asking the wrong

Heidiperson that question. >> You've never done that? No. >> Okay. Um, >> I date with intention. >> Hold. You date with intention?

Brian Atlas>> Like, I don't know if you've You've said you have a roster. You've not had a boyfriend. You >> like if I'm going on an I'm not just question their time. >> Hold on.

Brian Atlas>> I wouldn't go on the date in the first place. You're currently in a complicated situation with a male porn star and you've have you been going on dates during the course of this like

Brian Atlascomplicated rel situationship with the male sex worker >> occasionally. >> How could you possibly be dating with intention? Like if I'm going on a date

Brian Atlaswith a girl and she's like got feelings and hangs out with a dude and like hold >> and you guys are sexually active together. You're not having sex, but

Brian Atlasyou're like doing oral sex or whatever. How is it dating with intention if I'm going on a date with a girl and she's she's involved with a guy who took her virginity

Brian Atlasand singing his D from time to time and he's a sex worker. How is that dating with intention? You're not properly single. >> But I'm not taken. I'm not exclusive.

HeidiThere's no loyalty. >> So the dating intention is that I'm not going on a date with somebody I'm not interested in. Not going on a like I'm going on a date to see like is there

Brian Atlascompatibility there? Could this be a partner? Like if they commit like okay, I'm going to be loyal to How would you feel if you were on a date with a guy who is in the

Brian Atlasexact same situation as you, but with like the person he's seeing is a woman? >> Most guys are in our generation. >> Yeah. Is that good or bad? >> I mean, it just is what it is. I'm used to that.

Heidi>> But is that good or bad? >> Like, do you think it's good? For example, do you think it's >> I don't think it's good, but I think it's normalized in our generation. Like, everybody in our generation has a roster. It doesn't mean it's

Brian Atlas>> not everybody, but um I mean you you wouldn't have any issue like you would >> I guess this is why you're just constantly kind of trapped in

Brian Atlassituationships. You're kind of tied down dating this guy who's a sex worker who you give BJs to how frequent? I don't

Brian Atlasknow, once a week or something. I don't know. You give him BJs from time to time and then like then have you ever done this? Have you ever gone on a date with a guy the same day you gave him a BJ?

Brian Atlas>> No. >> That sounds like a yes, but you don't want to admit to it. Uh oh man, that's brutal. Imagine going on a date with a girl. She gives you a kiss good night, but she like sucked a dude's dick early in the >> Oh, that's a beauty.

Brian Atlas>> Or what if a guy pays for a date? Have you ever done this? Have you ever gone on a date with a dude? Oh, >> and then >> he buys your dinner or whatever and then you go over to

Heidimale sex worker's house and do what you do with him. >> I've been on a date with a guy and the other guy called me and asked me to come over and I didn't.

Heidi>> You You give a 24-hour >> You give a 24-hour grace period. >> No, I just didn't go.

Brian Atlasdidn't go the next day. It was just >> Okay. 48 hour grace period. I see. I don't know, man. I don't know. [ __ ] >> Are you really d You said you were

Brian Atlasdating intentionally, though. That's >> Yeah, that's a very specific thing. >> Like I I think in order to date intentionally, you have to be properly single. If you have a side piece or

Heidiwhatever or some dude you're seeing and you're seeing him and then you're going on dates, how is that intentional?

Heidi>> If I get asked on 15 dates a day and I don't go, it's cuz I'm not interested. But if I go on a date, I clearly have interest and there's intention behind me going on that date in the first place.

HeidiMeeting up with you, taking time out of my day to even go on that date. Do you have feelings for this dude? >> Yeah. >> What are the feelings? >> Like if he asked me to be his girlfriend, I would say yes.

Brian Atlas>> Oh, okay. Wait, >> wait, the porn star. >> So, are you like holding out that that's the future potential possibility? >> Wait a second. >> God, I hope not. >> No, but like I think

Brian Atlas>> in the like if that was a possibility, I would say yes. >> Well, how about this? Here's the scenario. Let's say you're So, you're still seeing him currently. Say you just start like going on a date with this new

Brian Atlasguy and it's still really early on. So, there hasn't been a conversation about what's this going to be. Maybe you've gone on two, three dates with a new guy, but you're still seeing this guy. This

Brian Atlasguy says the the sworker guy who you took your virginity, whatever. You've been seeing him for a year. He says, "I want you to be my girlfriend." You you stop with the two to three date guy, right? I'm assuming.

Brian Atlas>> Yeah. >> Okay. Hey, how can you be dating dating intentionally if a guy's been on two or three dates with you, but there's like this dude in the background who you're secretly pining for and >> nobody said it was a secret.

Brian Atlas>> Well, okay. >> It's it's more about communication. If you're communicating that with the person you're >> You tell Hold on. You tell the guys you go on first dates with, "By the way, I'm

Brian Atlasdating intentionally, so I just want to let you know I'm currently providing oral sex to a male sex worker who took my virginity who I'm secretly kind of in

Heidilove with, but not really. But I would be his girlfriend at any point if he asked me." If a guy >> you tell you tell guys that >> if a guy on a dating app is asking me out and I go on a date with him and he's

Heidilike, "Hey, by the way, I'm going out with five other girls like this week." It's like, okay, you're exploring your options. I'm exploring mine. What's the difference?

PaulinaLike, I'm going to be open that, hey, we're not exclusive. I don't owe you anything. It's >> not dating with intention, though. >> Yeah, that's not really intentional dating, I would say. So, wait. The porn

Paulinastar that you said was a [ __ ] >> Is this the one that you would want to be your boyfriend? >> Cuz you said he was a [ __ ] earlier and you that was one of your issues with him.

Heidi>> Yeah, because he >> But you want him to make you would want to be exclusive with him. You want to be >> uh Thank you for that. 20 memberships. Thank you. Keep Sorry. Go ahead. Continue. >> You would want to be with the [ __ ] >> Yes. I wouldn't want him to be a [ __ ]

Ellie / Jamiewhen he's with me. But you don't get to complain about him then. >> But he's already >> like proven he is a [ __ ] Like you >> a hoe for sure. >> You could you could be doing

Ellie / Jamie>> so much better. >> Do you do you think that if you got off of social media and found another form of income that maybe would be providing you the same like you know equivalence

Ellie / Jamieto what you're getting now and like removed yourself off of dating apps and social media and all that. Do you think that one you would be getting as many

Heidipeople interested and two would you maybe be finding like better people possibly perhaps? I mean I went to

Heidicollege twice. That's not what I asked. Um I've already experienced that life before social media. I've gone on those dates with those normal guys like and

Ellie / Jamieit's it still didn't work then. Why am I going to like there's more options now? >> Yeah, but it doesn't seem like they're quality options. It just seem like quantity over quality. Like if you found

Ellie / Jamiea guy that is not a sexworking [ __ ] or a, you know, a non-committal type or like unemotional, emotionally unavailable, like say you found like your perfect dude.

Heidi>> Mhm. Like would you get rid of all this extra [ __ ] and >> Yeah, of course. Of course. If I found somebody that had like the same values I

Heidihave and like we had that mutual bond and like we really like liked each other and he was willing to commit to me. >> Yeah, I'd be more than willing to drop everything. >> But you've also stated

HeidiI am like still exploring options. I'm not just loyal to that guy who is a [ __ ] I see you are, >> but I wouldn't be going on dates with guys if I wasn't interested in seeing

Heidiother people. >> That's definitely not necessarily true. >> I mean, it might not be true for other people, but that's my thing. I'm not just going out with any guy that asks me out. >> Yeah. I mean, that would probably be

Heidicrazy and stupid, >> but a lot of people do just for the free dinner. >> Yeah. Okay. Well, that's not right either. >> Yeah. I don't agree with that. And that's Yeah. If

Ellie / Jamieyou've already said that you're not interested or willing to settle down with anyone because you haven't leveled up to the point to where you feel like you need to be in order to do that. What if the perfect guy were to come along?

Ellie / JamieWould you drop that to be with him? >> Yeah. Yeah, I think that's true. Yeah, I do think that's true. I hope that for you, I guess. You know, I think you

Ellie / Jamiecould probably find it. Maybe not in LA, but I think you probably find it. But that would be dating with intention. That would be like dating with the intent to be with someone and maybe not

Ellie / Jamiewade through a prior patch of manhores and [ __ ] social media guys. Doesn't seem like you're going to get what you want by doing the same thing that you're

Brian Atlasdoing now and have been. I respect your point of view. >> I respect that. >> Okay. Well, I don't know if I got a

Brian Atlasdefinitive answer on this, but okay. The bow video, you were very upset. Very upset by the bow video. Uh, >> just bow, >> I guess. >> Man, >> what what was the objections again for

Heidithe to the bow? >> I just don't think that's a form of respect from the girl. Like, I mean, it's >> it's actually quite >> like I just What if he bows back? What

Heidiif he bows to you? >> I wouldn't bow back. He wasn't. He wouldn't do that. >> So, it's just the ick it's just icky, you know? I wouldn't do that to my man. It's just like >> But you

SPEAKER_14>> It's like showing that. >> But you do for that actually in other ways. >> Well, >> like what? >> It's essentially she just clocked her actually the D. >> But she does. It's a It's a It's a form

Brian Atlasof a bow. >> You get it. >> You were. >> Oh, right. You get it. >> Well, this is a point I actually make. Um because like you know I I get the initial knee-jerk reaction to the battle

Brian Atlasis like whoa. >> First off it's like people culturally don't really do that in the United States. >> Uh so there's that component but it's also just like even if it was like

Brian Atlasmoving I guess removing the like >> uncommon cultural component of it. >> Yeah. There's there's another objection to I'm not willing to do this sort of

Brian Atlasact of subser like submission to a guy. Like that's icky to me to like do like it's a ask from the guy's perspective.

Brian Atlas>> I'm not going to do that which what he want hold on that [ __ ] words do because you said so. >> I'm not going to do that thing that he wants me to do. >> But then I start thinking about it. It's

Brian Atlasum by the way the bow it didn't just coales out of the ether. People have been even in white cultures have been doing bows although it's like not common anymore. >> Um so it's not like I'm culturally

Brian Atlasappropriating like >> Asian cultures or whatever. >> Would you bow for the uh for the perfect man? >> No. >> Just curious going around the table. Who here >> that's crazy. >> I'll come back to the perfect man thing.

PaulinaWho here would bow for a guy >> while you No. Would you bow for a guy? >> Yeah, maybe. >> She guess. >> It's kind of It's not even my culture like that. >> But if you're you're married,

Brian Atlas>> if I'm Japanese, that's that's a given. >> No, you're white. Well, what are you >> Italian Spaniard? >> Okay. Yeah. >> So, definitely not like a bow culture. >> We don't even do that orthodox. >> If your husband watched the whatever

Brian Atlaspodcast and he's like, you know, that Brian guy's on to something. >> You're setting a weird temp. >> He's on to something. You know, hey, look, we eat some. Have you ever eat? But I understand. >> Have you had chopst Have you used chopsticks? >> Yeah.

Brian Atlas>> Okay. So, there you go. >> Yeah. Once in a while. So, I'm not I mean, I'm not using it. >> Makes sense, right? >> They bow in the Catholic church. >> Uh, you know. >> Oh, yeah. We do a little bit. >> Do you watch any anime? Attack on Titan or something? >> No, I don't get into anime. Whatever. >> I used to draw anime, but

Mars (USC)>> but yes, you would bow, but Okay. Would you bow? >> I don't know. I don't think so. >> Don't think so. Would you would you bow for for a guy? >> I don't think it's part of my culture or lifestyle, but if it really was so important to him, >> he wants a bow. We could have a

Brian Atlasconversation. >> Could have a conversation about it. >> We could have a conversation. >> What's the Okay, let's uh We're going to roleplay like we're dating. >> Well, for you, I feel like it almost feel like >> Excuse me, miss. >> Okay. >> I wish for you to bow. Let's have the

Mars (USC)combo. >> I feel like it feels like a power thing for you. You've made it clear that you want your woman submissive, and it's not a cultural thing. If it was cultural, I would totally respect it, but it's not. And for those reasons, I probably

Brian Atlaswouldn't bow to you. >> I see. Okay. I'm gonna bite the bullet and agree that it's it's 100% a power thing. What would actually be wrong in engaging with it? >> Well, I think it's just a matter of preference. I don't think there's

Mars (USC)anything inherently wrong with it. It's just not my cup of tea, so I won't be drinking it. >> Well, it was nice knowing you. Uh, >> goodbye. We're over. >> Okay. Uh, Ellie, would you

Ellie / Jamie>> I think you know my answer to this. >> Okay. She wants to throw it up as well. >> I'm Okay. I've actually reflected on this and I wish I hadn't done the demo bow in the first in the first time I was here.

Ellie / Jamie>> Retracted my bow. >> Retroactively taken back my bow. Rude >> because my perfect husband isn't here right now and I would only do it for him. You got to go like this >> to take it back.

Brian Atlas>> Maybe. Well, technically, what if your perfect husband is watching the stream and you would be bowing to him? >> Well, by technicality, but he's not here and so he wouldn't know it's directed

Zenatowards him. Okay. Uh, but you would bow to Okay. >> Would you bow uh >> for a guy >> if it was in his culture? >> No. Yes. >> Whitest dude you've ever seen?

Zena>> Then no. >> Or blackest dude you've ever seen? I don't know. >> Then no. >> There's not bowing in either of those. >> No. I guess I guess not because I like it's like what Mars was saying and like I feel like it just I it's just not my

Mars (USC)cup of tea. >> What about you? Um, I'm going to go with maybe. >> Well, your your your fiance. >> Oh. >> Um, if you woke up in the morning, he's

Mars (USC)like, "Babe, >> hey, I've been I've just watched the whatever podcast. I've been thinking >> I'm carrying his baby baby." >> Mhm. >> So, I I I feel like I'm not going to just break up with him over that. I'd be like, "Eh, like we could talk about it.

KamayaI guess it's kind of weird." But then I'd have him do something equally as weird just to even it out for me. >> Like what? What would be equally as weird? >> Uh you have to kiss my feet and you >> I was thinking >> that's not equally as weird. That's way more weird.

Kamaya>> That's >> that's way worse. >> Well, it's something in return of what I'm giving you cuz that's a weird request, especially out of the blue like that. >> If you started the relationship like that, then that's up to you if you want

Paulinato leave. But if it starts like in the middle of it, like >> I don't know what I would do. But were like our grandparents doing that that you know married for decades? You know I I'm sure there's ways that they've

Paulinashowed women of the time have showed subordination without bowing like that in the west. I've never seen that. >> Cooking his meals >> cooking his meals and all sorts of things. >> Other things. >> Didn't women in like the 1920s used to

Ellie / Jamiehave like a martini ready at home for their husbands when they got married? >> That sounds about right. >> That was their tribute to their drinking a martini. That is such a feminine drink. Beer for men only.

Ellie / Jamie>> No. Or like like two fingers of whiskey need or whatever. Like I was just going to be a martini. I don't know. I don't know. I just like like those little glasses. The little >> Make me a cos cosmopolitan.

Brian Atlas>> Cosmopolitan. >> One point for martini, please. >> Uh would you bow? Would you bow? >> Yeah, sure. >> Okay, >> John, if you're watching this. >> Boom. >> Oh, let's She said let's spice things

Ellie / Jamieup. >> Yeah. Is that like a dominance thing? >> He made it clear. I mean, it's a it's a >> it's not it's not it's not a BDSM thing. >> I understand that respect. It's a respect thing. And I think like Okay, so it goes back to I remember the third

Ellie / Jamieprinciple. Care for each others. By the way, care for the environment, care for the self, care for others. >> Um even in like monatory principles like we were taught to like you know have like the utmost respect for your

Ellie / Jamieenvironment. So like I mean as young as like preschool in like some Asian countries and most Asian countries they actually have like the kids cleaning the classroom >> and like taking off their shoes before you come in

Ellie / Jamie>> and like you know preparing snack and sharing it with friends like it is it it's a >> it's a thing of hospitality of

Ellie / Jamiespirituality. It is uh a way of showing kind of sort of like this God's love of of some sort, you know, >> and especially to your man because I mean like if he's taking care of you, if

Ellie / Jamiehe's protecting you, if he's making sure that he's walking on the side of, you know, the sidewalk with the street, you know, he's going to be the first one that's going to uh take on a home intruder or like an alligator or

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