Feminist ACCUSES Him Of MlSOGYNY?! RAGE QUIT?! She Went FERAL?! Andrew Wilson! | Dating Talk #244

Date: 2025-05-26

Duration: 9h 51m

Guests

Brian Atlas

JJasmine (Jazz)>

LLauren Selby >

SSavannah Stone >

JJulie (SPC DT244)>

AAndrew Wilson >

Identified Speakers

SPEAKER_02Erica Perry(guest)

SPEAKER_03Amy Jeffers(guest)

SPEAKER_04Lauren Selby(guest)

SPEAKER_06Andrew Wilson(guest)

SPEAKER_07Julie (SPC DT244)(guest)

SPEAKER_09Brian Atlas(host)

SPEAKER_10Nasica(guest)

SPEAKER_11Carla Leto(guest)

SPEAKER_12Jasmine (Jazz)(guest)

SPEAKER_13Savannah Stone(guest)

Key Moments

IntroAll guests introduced

ControversyJazz: burning misogynistic man could be 'net positive' for society

Key MomentAndrew Wilson joins as call-in guest

Key MomentAndrew donates $3,000 for Savannah Stone honeymoon

ControversyJazz accuses Brian and Andrew of misogyny

OtherAndrew Wilson departs the show

Topics Discussed

Guest Introductions

Including Jazz (feminist), Savannah Stone (married, anti-feminism), Carla Leto (LMFT).

Woman Sets Man on Fire

News article: woman set boyfriend on fire after misogynistic comment.

Feminism/Gender Liberation

Jazz defends feminist views. Accused burning man of being "net positive."

Andrew Wilson Joins

Call-in. Debates Jazz on marriage, commitment, feminism. Donates $3K for Savannah.

Jazz Accuses Misogyny

Directly accuses Brian and Andrew of being misogynistic.

Body Count Discussion

Final topic.

Transcript

Page 4 of 11

Erica Perrymy statement was saying is that when you were sitting here with the male feminist, you were like, "I need a drink for this." I wouldn't categorize that as having a drink with the boys or having a

Erica Perrydrink to um combat like uh work work life. That was you trying to compensate for How is that not combating work life? You're So you wouldn't claim that you're

Erica Perryan alcoholic lately? I'm an alcoholic. At least I'm not an alcoholic. Oh, I would I would argue that I would argue the latter. Yeah, we were we're both alcoholics. We're one and the same. I'm

Erica Perryjust trying to We're We're together in this. Lady, stop filibustering me. And listen, what does that mean? Alcoholics are dependent on alcohol to function. You don't think you are? You had to function. You had to depend on it to

Andrew Wilsonfunction with the male feminist. Stop sping lady. You couldn't even like deal with him sober. Stop burgering lady. Let me finish what I'm saying. Okay, you're right. I literally go for months without

Erica Perryhaving a drink. Months and months. I do it all the time. And okay, I didn't see it here. So what? I had a drink in the studio. Oh my god. I'm just arguing that you you

Erica Perrypartake in gluttony. So you can't you can't come at people you can't come at people saying abortion is wrong when you literally you no no no no. You literally

Erica Perrycome into the seven sins the deadly sins or whatever you pertain to the Bible. Yeah. Light that cirut baby. I'm like I wish I had a joint with me. [ __ ] [ __ ] We can get Yes. Honestly I wish you were here. We can take a shot together.

Andrew WilsonAndrew love you. All right, let's get into the stuff. No, hang on. I'm not done. Actually, you want to? Let's go, Andrew. Come on. I'll sit here and try to calculate how many shots of alcohol I've ever taken if

Erica Perryyou tell us how many dicks you've had to suck. Oh, yeah. I love a dick in my mouth. How many? How many? I can't tell you. How many have you had? You don't remember, do you? Now, do you remember

Erica Perryyours? How many? I don't remember how many shots I've had in my life. No, I'm not talking about shots. I think if I say to how many vagina holes have you put your dick inside of the equivalent of Wait, I have a question. Hold on.

Andrew WilsonHold on. What is your body count, Andrew? I would love to know. Please don't. So anyway, so again, real quick, I'm trying to dive into this. Okay. Okay, let's go. Is it the case that if I

Andrew Wilsontold a woman I don't remember how many shots I've had in my life, that she's going to respond to that the same way a man will respond if you say, I don't remember how many dicks I've sucked in my life. What is that? Wait, hold on. Say it again. That was like said really

Andrew Wilsonweird. I'm sorry. I'm like I'm neurode divergent slightly. I'm sorry. Yeah. Do you think that me telling a woman I don't remember how many shots I've taken in my life that she would take that and respond to it a lot better than you

Erica Perrytelling a man you don't remember how many dicks you've sucked in your life? Well, it's two different species of male and female. So like it's two different species. Huh. Yeah, I I agree. Male male and female are two different species

Erica Perrycompletely. Well, you didn't think that one through, did you? No, I didn't. But I've seen your I've seen your arguments. Hey, Andrew species. Andrew, you have argued that male and female are two

Erica Perrydifferent species. So don't ever I've never argued that males and females are two different species. Oh [ __ ] I Okay, maybe I heard your argument wrong. [ __ ] I [ __ ] it up. My bad. Two different

Andrew Wilsonspecies genders. Like men and women are like dogs and humans. Like what? What do you Dogs and cats? No, I've never made an argument that we're a different

Andrew Wilsonspecies because I'm not [ __ ] stupid. Oh, so you think women are stupid? Not women, but one woman I'm talking to. Oh, you think I'm stupid? Lovely. At least

Andrew Wilsonone woman. So why pluralistic? Like if you say that woman over there is stupid. She's like, "So you think all women are stupid?" Does that even make sense? I'm I never I never proclaim to be smart. Am

Erica PerryI saying right now I'm the smartest [ __ ] at this table? No. Like I've I've acknowledged I'm neurode divergent. So you're basically mocking my like lack of brain cells.

Erica PerryNeur neurode divergent means you have a lack of brain cells. I have a lack of working brain cells. Yes. I agree. Thank you. All right. I'm glad you guys common ground there. That was I love the I love

Brian Atlasthe common ground spectrum. Uh all right. We're going to get into uh get into some substance here. So uh let's see here. Uh we'll we'll do a few from

Brian Atlasyou, Julie, then we'll come back to them later because uh I think we're gonna Jazz and Andrew are gonna uh square up a little bit. So, okay. Uh over what? And Andrew, these are Julie's notes. We're

Brian Atlasgoing to try to move through these ones quickly so we can't linger too long on them, but uh Julie, you said, "Staying in marriage for kids. Women can't have sex when they don't love the other person. You can't. Men need sex. Furthermore, men will sacrifice

Brian Atlaseverything for their family. women are generally not capable of doing so despite trying. Do you want to elaborate on that a bit? Sure. So, obviously there's a bunch of tangents there, but

Julie (SPC DT244)um I know I've listened to you before and and uh you've spoken about uh people staying in marriages, right? Um kind of work just working through everything. I

Julie (SPC DT244)mean so one of the questions I have for you is for example if uh if a woman if there's say

Julie (SPC DT244)for the fact that they didn't get along without going into detail uh over several years they didn't really get along and eventually that caused distress for the woman to where she fell

Julie (SPC DT244)out of love. Um, I think for a lot of women, uh, they're or at least for me, I can't have sex with someone if I'm not in love with them, right? Um, and I

Julie (SPC DT244)think that men need sex. I think it's, uh, just innate, it's natural. Nothing wrong with it whatsoever. So, do you think it can still work through that?

Julie (SPC DT244)Uh, can can they move beyond that? I I probably didn't explain that very well, but Sorry. Are you asking me? Yes. Yeah, this is for you. For you, Andrew. Okay.

Andrew WilsonSo, let me make sure I get a couple things clear just to make sure I got it right. When you say that you can't have sex with anybody unless you're in love with them, right? Does this mean that if you found a man to be extremely

Julie (SPC DT244)attractive that you would just be unable to have sex with them? Let me let me go back. So in the beginning stage in the beginning stages of a relationship when two people are very attracted to each other um I I would I would agree there's

Julie (SPC DT244)still some element of waiting but when you get to that point at which you have these strong feelings for another person right so there's there's that at that point at which you can be intimate with

Julie (SPC DT244)someone right um and then obviously you fall in love and so on and so forth so I so I do agree that there's that that initial piece when you're you know in the initial stages But

Julie (SPC DT244)but beyond that, you mean the attraction piece, right? Right. Like if I'm if I went out and was really attracted to someone, I I still

Julie (SPC DT244)can't do it. I I have to have feelings involved, some rather serious feelings before I I can do that. So once you get into a marriage and you've been together

Julie (SPC DT244)for years, and I'm not not just asking for myself, I'm just asking in general for many people because I think there's a lot of marriages where uh that that's the case. Um I think more so it's

Julie (SPC DT244)challenging for men. So do how do you think that works? What's the challenge? Or I guess two two pieces. Um and I apologize for being all over the place. Um yeah. Yeah. No no problem. How does

Julie (SPC DT244)how does a man stay in a in a marriage for years and years potentially without uh receiving sex from his wife? And then I guess the other part that I didn't ask

Julie (SPC DT244)was how does women have a harder time I think uh hiding or faking emotions to look happy for the children because ultimately it's necessary, right? You don't want your children uh growing up

Julie (SPC DT244)with people that are unhappy or who are unhappy. Um, so how do you in your in your eyes, how do you make that work? Like what does that look like to you? And I'm only asking because I've been

Andrew Wilsonlistening to several conversations. Yeah. Yeah. So from which view? So from both, I guess. How this Yeah. How how would this work from the Christian view or how would this work from the

Andrew Wilsonnon-Christian view? Um, either way. Either way. Okay. So from the Christian view, she's not fulfilling her um duties inside of the

Andrew Wilsonmarriage and there would be probably ecclesiastical intervention from the priest and community to try to assist with whatever the problem is. Maybe he's uh fat or he stinks or you know maybe I

Andrew Wilsondon't you know who knows what the actual issues are or it could just be that she's no longer attracted to him. There could be all sorts of uh of various issues but I mean that would be how that would be dealt with. that would be dealt

Andrew Wilsonwith inside of the community. Um, and generally is right. Even people who seek marital help are basically doing the same thing. They're looking for some kind of uh like third party or arbiter

Andrew Wilsonto assist them with whatever those, you know, marital issues are. So, I don't I don't know if you're asking me something beyond that, you know, and I'm missing

Julie (SPC DT244)it or No, I guess I'm just um thinking of the of the greater good in certain circumstances, right? whether whether it's Christian or whether it's

Andrew Wilsonwhat's ideally best for children. Um so so either way I I I I mean it is best it is generally best for children for their parents to stay together. It's not monolithic. There's

Andrew Wilsonobviously going to be some cases where that's not the case. But overwhelmingly it is the case where um if the parents stay together their children are definitely going to have way better outcomes. Mhm. So

Julie (SPC DT244)ultimately, but I mean what if what if there isn't a way to work around that? What if what if the woman has tried, you know, has done her best to do her duty? And you know, it's the

Andrew Wilsonthing is is like this is an interesting question. I and I talk about this a lot with various people from all over the place, but when I start to hone in on the specifics because in this case,

Andrew Wilsonwe're making like kind of a general statement. It is generally true that if parents stay together, even if they like don't have that spark or whatever it is, it's probably going to be better for the

Andrew Wilsonchildren. That's that that is factually true. But then the question is like what if it's the case that they just are so bad for each other that they can't make

Andrew Wilsonit work? But anytime I we discuss it and I hone in on the specifics, if there's not abuse or uh drug addiction or things like this, usually it's just one person's not trying at all. They just don't want to participate in the

Amy Jeffersrelation. Can I pipe in on this real quick on this thing? I'm It's me. Um this whole uh stay together stay together, you know, for the kids thing.

Amy JeffersKids are not stupid. Okay, that's the thing about parents and about adults. They try to underestimate kids. Kids are not [ __ ] stupid. They see and they

Amy Jeffersknow everything. They hear everything. They know when their parents are [ __ ] in their beds. Okay, I know I did. I could wake up in, you know, 2 o'clock in the morning and hear the water bed

Amy Jeffersslloshing. I mean, that's how old I am. I had a water bed parents. Remember water beds? Yeah, but don't stay together because of the kids. No, because they know when you

Amy Jeffersguys fight, they know when you guys are being fake. And you know what? That's not good psychologically for a child to know that you don't give love to your spouse. You don't give love to your the

Amy Jeffersperson you're supposed to love, okay? The person that you conceived with to bring them in the world with. And all of a sudden, you don't. And then you're just like acting like [ __ ] roommates.

Andrew WilsonAre you kidding me? You think a kid doesn't realize that? Stop it. So, I'll address kind of your arguments here. I've heard them a million times from feminist. And if it's because of child

Amy Jefferssupport payments, well, you know what? Guess what? You're going to pay [ __ ] child support whether you like it or not. Well, I'll address I'll address everything you just said. I've heard this a million times from feminists, but

Amy JeffersI'm not a feminist. I don't like feminism. And that's why where we are today with this [ __ ] gender [ __ ] because of feminism. Do you remember how I didn't cut you off at all unless you finish your entire thing before I before

Andrew WilsonI said anything. Maybe you can do me the same courtesy. Okay. Thank you. You're welcome. Yeah. Well, I don't know why you're thanking yourself and then welcoming yourself. But anyway, in any case, back to this. So, sorry. Not

Andrew Wilsonsorry. The reason Okay. So anyway, the reason that these sorts of arguments don't hold up is because first of all, children in their tender years don't really remember [ __ ] right? They don't. That's called their

Amy Jeffersformative years. Yeah. So, so here's the thing. When when do they need the formulation of mom and dad the most? Always. Because always kids know when parents are being loving to each other.

Andrew WilsonCan you tell me what what does the word most mean? Do you know what that word means? So, when do they need it most is the question I asked you. Not not do they always need it, but what you gonna give

Amy Jeffersme a [ __ ] statistic on most? Really? I mean, a kid when they see their parents together and when they see their parents loving every together. Hang on. Can you stop freaking out and just calm

Andrew Wilsondown for a second so I can ask the question? If you had a set, I'm just answering the goddamn question. So, so anyway, if you had to pick a set of years in which were the most important

Andrew Wilsonyears for a child, which years would you put those in? 0 to five. Formative years, right? Exactly. The formative years. There we go. So, those would be the So, if you don't show your wife or

Amy Jeffersshe don't show you love in those formative years, that kid is not going to know what love is either. If you show your kid love, they are not. Yeah. So, I mean, how come all of the research on

Andrew Wilsonthis is completely against you? That even if it's the case, the case for abuse, especially for what? What research? Spock. Yeah. Dr. Spock. Here's

Andrew WilsonDr. [ __ ] Spock. Yeah. Here's here's what you can find. If I mean, if I I'm I I understand that it's difficult for you because this morning was maybe the first time in weeks that you had to get off of

Andrew Wilsonyour back, but if you could just No seconds, we can actually dive in. I ain't had no [ __ ] dick in about 2 and 1/2 years. And that's not even the reason. I don't even want it, man. Yes. Anyway, so the thing is is like if we if

Andrew Wilsonwe look at the stats, yes, this is indeed the case that it's cohabitation. Epitome of my [ __ ] misery is what y'all are find where you find the abuse. I mean, I don't know. I don't know. Maybe maybe you just don't want to have a conversation. You just want to freak

Carla Letoout. Um, can I ask a question? when you say that it's always better that the parents stay together. Um, as long as there's no abuse or anything like that, better than actually that's not what I

Andrew Wilsonsaid. Okay. Uh, I didn't say it's always clarify what you What did I Hang on. So, I get straw man constantly. The reason is is because like ladies I was just talking to, they can't be quiet long enough to listen to what I'm saying. So

Andrew Wilsoneven though I listen to you even even though I will listen to everything they just said when I'm giving a response they they they just can't even chill out for 5 seconds to even hear what I'm saying. So that's what happens is people

Andrew Wilsonstraw me at me constantly. I didn't actually say in all cases. I wouldn't say that because that would be a monolith. I'm just saying that generally this is true. Generally. Okay. Most cases we could say at least in most cases this is true. Generally better

Carla Letothan And there's that most thing that you were talking about again. Okay. Well, hold on. I I want to make a point. So better than Yeah. Remember how I used that word in context so it actually made sense? Better than what? Better than divorce across the board. Better than

Andrew Wilsonbetter than a child living in two different homes. Better than not. Well, the conditional of divorce most often leads to cohabitation between you and somebody who's not the the parent of your child. And it's in the cohabitation

Andrew Wilsonwhere you see the largest forms of abuse, either from single mothers or from their partners. You rarely see this type of abuse inside of homes where you have the biological father and the

Andrew Wilsonbiological mother. The abuse rates drastically decrease almost across the board even if the parents report that they're not particularly happy in that

Julie (SPC DT244)marriage. Would you say that's the same that that translates also to uh like having a stepchild where you have one non-parent and one and then

Andrew Wilsonalso a a child that the marriage. So I'm a step Yeah. I'm a stepfather myself. So again, it's not it's not monolithic. But it is the case generally speaking that you're going to see a whole hell of a lot more abuse of your children from

Andrew Wilsonstepparents than you are from their biological parents. There's just no ifs or buts about that. Every stat you'd ever look at would reaffirm that that's the case. But cohabitation is where it's

Andrew Wilsonthe most dangerous. and cohabitation. Even for the the unaliving of men where they unal alive themselves, those rates skyrocket during cohabitation as well. Far less likely even than if you're

Andrew Wilsondivorced than if you're cohabitating to unal alive yourself. So almost all of these So if divorce generally leads to cohabitation, cohabitation, which means you living with a person without

Andrew Wilsonmarrying them, generally leads to these kind of wildly bad outcomes for people. Then it would seem that keeping marriages intact would be a better idea for society or at least some of them have good outcomes. Some blended some of

Carla Letothem have good outcomes. A lot of not I mean there's a presumption here that um divorce leads to cohabitation in abusive households. There are a lot of divorces that result in two happy homes. No,

Andrew Wilsonthere's not that. Well, here's the thing. There are there are cases where that is true and I wouldn't dispute that. Again, I'm not I'm not putting things in a monolith, but generally speaking, it is not actually good for

Andrew Wilsonthe children to come from broken homes. Most children from broken homes have way worse outcomes than children who are not in broken homes. And if children are raised in cohabitation homes, they have

Andrew Wilsonway worse outcomes. In fact, you can look at things like u this one blew my mind. If you have two parents who are abusive to their kids Mhm. and then the

Andrew Wilsonstate comes in and removes those children from the abusive household, they're actually far far more likely to die in state custody than if you had left them in the abusive home. Well,

Andrew Wilsonyeah, because they've just been ripped away from their biological parents in another foster. Well, well, right. You see, but you see how divorce rips you away from your biological parents. It depends on

Andrew Wilsontheact Yeah. Exactly. Like you're saying, it depends on the theory. Exactly. But it doesn't depend if your if your mommy and daddy don't live with you anymore, right? You're ripped away from one of them or the other of them at

Andrew Wilsonany given time. So if you're with mom for two weeks and then you're with dad for two weeks or you're with them every other week, right? You're missing time with one of them necessarily. It's a necessary condition of divorce. You're

Andrew Wilsonripped away from your parents. Necessary condition. There's no way around it for all cases. every single case unless unless you were to have some bizarre case where the mom and dad divorce and

Andrew Wilsonthen stay in the same home for the purpose of kids that's happened before and those kids even seem to have better outcomes which is interesting I do have to move

SPEAKER_05ultimately pickles donated $200 dear granny why are you so aggressive this toxic femininity is very dangerous quick respon you want to respond to that

Amy Jeffersa Grammy I'm not a [ __ ] [ __ ] granny, dude. Got a 15-year-old. Who's a [ __ ] granny around here? [Laughter]

Brian AtlasExcuse you. Sorry, Andrew. I thought you were uh didn't mean to cut you off there, Andrew. Do you want to finish your point, but then we'll we'll move it on. Yeah, I'm just I'm just saying like

Andrew Wilsonum what so often happens Sorry. Sorry. What so often happens is the sum all categorization which is incorrect and most people argue from this which is

Andrew Wilsonjust silly right it's like if you say generally speaking it is the case that the sun will be shining tomorrow in Santa Barbara I am correct that that is true but you could still have a sunrise

Andrew Wilsonin Santa Barbara and not see it because it's an overcast day right it's like I wouldn't put it at anything in a monolith that way but we can still look at outcomes general outcomes as a society and everything policy-wise is a

Andrew Wilsongive or take. You're taking from this group and this group is going to be disproportionately affected. That's politics 101. There's no way to plate everybody. But we still know exactly what's good for the social adjustment of

Andrew Wilsona society. Like that's that's not even in question. We have 2,000 years of history to look at to know what are social goods inside of society and what aren't. All right, we're going to move it to

Brian AtlasJulie. We'll come back to some of your other notes in a little bit, but uh going here to jazz. So, jazz, uh we had a bit of an extensive back and

Brian Atlasforth when you initially, uh had asked to be on the show. Let me get that pulled up here in just a moment. There's quite a bit. Okay, sorry, one sec. Scrolling all

Brian Atlasthe way up. Oh my, how many notes do I have? Uh, okay. Uh actually one thing before we get into that. I was asking everybody to raise their hands before uh quick question for you Jazz. We won't

Brian Atlaslinger on it long. Uh you're a feminist but you raised your hand for almost every single one when it come came to men should pay for first aids. You raised your hand. Men should be providers. Men should be providers. Men should open car doors. Men should be men

Brian Atlasshould be chivalous. Men should observe the sidewalk rule. How do you reconcile being a feminist? And your description of the This is how we got kind of sidetracked. Uh we weren't really talking about equal rights, but you were

Brian Atlasmaking the argument that while society in terms of gender expectations, gender norms, there's like negative gender expectations on men, negative gender expectations on women. You

Brian Atlasyourself seem to perpetuate uh traditional gender norms in terms of your dating prospects. So how do you reconcile being a feminist being in favor of sort of

Brian Atlasdismantling gender norms, gender expectations, but on the individual personal level you hold men to said

Jasmine (Jazz)traditional gender roles. Yes. So we do exist in society and men are the perpetrators uh in violence against women. So I do need a protector uh

Jasmine (Jazz)especially how we condition gender to be. Men are stronger. Again, if you want to go the nature route, biological route, they have higher levels of testosterone, so they can gain more

Jasmine (Jazz)muscle and all of these things. Um, so in a sense, yeah, when we live in reality and I do need a protector because of the circumstances, yes, I would like

Jasmine (Jazz)somebody who fits that role personally. But I do think that it is negative to push that. When it comes to wanting the

Jasmine (Jazz)outcome of gender liberation on a grand scale, it is um negative to push roles like that. Wait, wait a second. You don't you don't need that. What do you

Jasmine (Jazz)mean? Why do you need that protection? Why do you need that? Yeah. I mean, I think it's pretty obvious if we look at the statistics when it comes to violence between genders. Do you want

Andrew Wilsonus to believe that you're selecting men based on the fact that they can protect you, not because you find that attractive, but because you just find it to be utilitarian? Uh, I think there might be a little bit

Jasmine (Jazz)of both. Sure. That it is. Why would you be attracted to that? Um, yeah. You're going to go like the biological and genetic route with this and sure that I read Was it you who wrote the essay? Was

Andrew Wilsonit her who wrote the essay? Oh, did you read my essay, Brian? I read it. Yeah, it's her. She Yeah, I did. I did. Yeah, I did, too. It was forwarded. It was forwarded over to me. I just want to let you know that you got to redo the last paragraph. There was a bunch of formal

Jasmine (Jazz)names there. You didn't capitalize. But, uh, that aside, is it bell hooks? Cuz they're not It's They're not meant to be capitalized. No, there was there was actual Yeah, there was Oh, really? Okay, that's my bad. Also, I didn't know anyone was reading it. It was just for

Andrew Wilsonfun. But thank you. Any other feedback is great. Thank you. Well, it all all your entire essay revolves around blank slate theory, which I don't even think that you believe. So, idea. Well, when

Andrew Wilsonyou when you make an appeal, you say that it's it's somewhat bad or somehow bad for or um should not happen that men don't show expressive emotion. That

Andrew Wilsonseemed to be one of the key points that you were pointing out in your essay. But there's a problem there, which is I think you just kind of fundamentally misunderstand what masculinity and femininity are. And that's what blank slate theory is. It's saying that

Andrew Wilsonmasculinity and femininity are just social traits which are conditioned by the environment. That's what you believe. But that's not the case. And here's why that's not the case. Masculinity and femininity revolve

Andrew Wilsonaround the idea of virtues. The way that we assign what is masculine is based along virtues. Things like courage for instance for women. Maybe it would be along the lines of chastity.

Andrew WilsonRight? The reason they you assign these to men and women is because if there is a lack of one in one sex versus the other, the social conditions of society begin to deteriorate rapidly. So if

Andrew Wilsonwomen aren't chased, the social conditions of society actually deteriorate far more rapidly than if men aren't chased. However, if women lost all courage tomorrow, so the societal conditions would deteriorate less

Andrew Wilsonrapidly than if men lost all courage tomorrow. That's why it's the case that femininity and masculinity must be tied to virtues and always have been. It's not just a matter of the blank slate

Andrew Wilsonsocial conditioning. It's you can't have a society without these very ideas of masculinity and femininity existing to begin with. Therefore, gender needs to actually have an assignment with sex for

Jasmine (Jazz)a good reason. Well, I was just going to ask if you think that that means that it should be gender specific. Like, why can't we just hold these values within

Andrew Wilsonsociety? Because I just I just explained why. If it is the case that men decided to not be courageous anymore

Andrew Wilsontomorrow, then the social ramifications in society would deteriorate so quickly that there would not be a society at all. However, if women stopped having

Andrew Wilsonthe same courage that men did, let's say for perhaps confronting intruders or going storming the battlefield or whatever it is, the social conditions inside of society would deteriorate far

Andrew Wilsonless. And so it's actually necessary for the sexes who can actually accommodate these goals and deeds to have these actual traits associated with their sex

Jasmine (Jazz)because they're the only ones who can really accommodate them. Okay. My take is just that perpetuating those ideas is pretty limiting to the human experience because then you

Jasmine (Jazz)wouldn't have women who feel masculine and go into male dominant roles. And I think that's just limiting to the human experience. I don't think that. Yeah. But do you like do you understand why it

Andrew Wilsonwould be so bad for us to take women and then try to mascul or you know make them masculine by moving them towards roles that they're not even biologically equipped for. But I'm not suggesting we

Jasmine (Jazz)do that. Yes, you are. I'm not suggesting we do that. I'm suggesting that there are people Well, this isn't a suggestion. There are people who exist outside of this gender heteronormative binary with these traits. What? Why do

Andrew Wilsonwhy why do you think it's a good idea to take society and the social roles that are inside of society and turn them all upside down to accommodate 5% of people? I'm not asking. Yeah, I'm not asking for

Amy Jeffersthose roles turned upside down. I'm just we not accepting of women because we have to accept men in our I'm sorry. I will never accept a [ __ ] man who has an Adam's apple dressed as a woman say

Amy Jeffershe's gonna come in my space as a woman and take over my [ __ ] I'm not. You know what? My mother and grandmother burned their bras for women's and I don't What

Amy Jeffersthe [ __ ] is this? Waves of feminism. Feminism is 1965, man. Okay. When we and and and we have the laws, Title Nine,

Amy JeffersTitle N. You're going to keep [ __ ] men in your spaces. You're going to keep men in your bathrooms. You're going to keep men in your spaces. And we're going to keep women in our spaces. And that's

Amy Jeffersit. I'm sick of this [ __ ] Stop it. You know what all this is? Is liberal [ __ ] propaganda [ __ ] that we have to accept a man being a woman? Really? Does your little Adam's apple go away

Amy Jefferswhen you decide you want to have tits and a [ __ ] [ __ ] getting your [ __ ] dick cut off? No. No. You're still a man and you always will be. That's it. And you know what? You're not going to come

Amy Jeffersin my rights. You're not going to come in my spaces and that's it. Sorry. You got mental illness and get hell for your mental illness. Enough with this [ __ ] this propaganda

Amy Jefferscrap. That's all it is. I've had it, man. I'm 52. Yeah, I know a lot of [ __ ] has changed for a lot of years, but you know what? This crap.

Amy JeffersNo. When it gets down to brass tax, yeah, I don't need this psycho babble. Okay? No. A man's a man, a woman's a woman, that's it. And no man can have a

Andrew Wilson[ __ ] baby and that's it, man. Yeah, but that so that actually makes the the best point for the lack of I don't care if it makes the best point. That's the common logical point. Okay,

Amy Jefferswe're getting back to common sense. Enough of this [ __ ] Okay. Oh, you want to twist the [ __ ] psychological around to make a man be a woman? Really?

Carla LetoCan they? Can you? I don't think he's he's not disagreeing with you. We know about We were about to hear his response to hear it. Can we hear it? Can go. I

Andrew Wilsondon't know considering that I'm one of the largest anti-trans proponents in the [ __ ] United States. Well, thank you. So am I. I don't know why the [ __ ] you would associate that with me, but okay. So anyway, why are you yelling at him?

Jasmine (Jazz)I'm not yelling at him. I'm sticking my head in the in the microphone is what I'm doing. After you've read my essay, I think we can just both agree. All of a sudden, I'm yelling now that we have fundamental differences. You were you were yelling. I just like I don't care

Andrew Wilsonif you want. I put my mouth in the microphone just like Brian said. Yeah. Put your mouth in the microphone. So yeah, back uh but yeah, back to this. She makes one of one of the most valid points that she makes is the idea of

Andrew Wilsonreproduction, right? It's like only one sex can reproduce and has control over reproduction. That's women. You agree that that's true since that's the one role that they can do that men can't do.

Andrew WilsonYou would think that you would want to socially be promoting reproduction unless you were an anti-natalist and you didn't want reproduction. It's the case that most feminists I've talked to are very much anti-natalist. It's baked into

Amy Jeffersfeminism itself. Can anybody give me a definition of a woman? I can give it. I can Can we listen to them speak? I don't I don't mean to be I I just I just had a moment a silent moment in the middle of of a

Amy Jeffersdiscussion debating. Yeah. I would change an adult human female. Yeah, that would be a woman. An adult, human, female. I just think Well, there is a definition, but anyway, go. I just think we fundamentally That's the actual

Amy Jeffersdefinition. Adult, human, female. That's what that's the actual definition of a woman. Yes. No, it's a human that menstruates because any human that menstruates from the age of 9 to about

Amy Jeffers45. No. So, you're saying that women who can Now, you can't have a baby. Maybe you can can have a baby. That's whether But you do menstruate. No [ __ ] man menstruate. He won't be able to menrate.

Andrew WilsonWell, that does a man menstruate. Does a man menstruate? No, of course not. Of course not. Of course not. But lady, the reason your definition is silly is because in a few years you probably won't be able to menrate. Well, I

Amy Jeffersalready do. I'm 52. I'm men. I'm menopausal. See, that's natural. So then you're not definition. Yes, I am a woman. It's called natural. Well, but you just said you have to menrate to be a woman. Well, from about 9 to about 45.

Andrew WilsonYes. And you know this to be true. You're married to a woman, right? So by your So by your definition, you're not a woman cuz you don't menrate. You know what? Come on now.

Amy JeffersBiologically, stop twisting the biological. You know, I mean to about 50. Yes, you are. Because menstruation Yes. You know what the biggest problem is? The biggest problem is is like even when we have because if a woman can't have a baby, it doesn't matter if you

Andrew Wilsoncan have a baby out of that menstruation, you are still a woman. Like for my side of it, even when I have people who agree with me, one of the biggest things that I have to deal with is that you present the argument. Oh, I'm supposed to agree with you. And

Julie (SPC DT244)yeah, I'm arguing with you. You're not letting him speak at all. You're you're not even paralleling what he's Well, stop putting that cigarette up to your [ __ ] face. Are you drunk? There's something wrong.

Amy JeffersYou don't You don't I mean, is are cigarettes that offensive to a prostitute? I'm not a prostitute, bro. You're only Are you an only? Oh, it's not Only Fans is a prostitute. There's a lot of other f things that goes on on

Andrew Wilsononly Only Fans than that. Yeah. Are you doing those other things or are you showing your boobies for money? Well, why don't you subscribe and find out? Yeah. So, you're doing that. Exactly. So, that's the thing is like don't like

Amy Jeffersdon't lie to me and say you're not a prostitute when you're a prostitute. That's not a prostitute. A prostitute is somebody [ __ ] somebody for money. Actually having sex somebody for money. You know what? You guys want to twist narratives. That's what this liberal

Amy Jeffers[ __ ] is. That's why the liberal [ __ ] took over the media. Yeah. That's why Spongeb was hidden for four [ __ ] years. You know, cuz the liberal

Amy Jeffersmedia all of a sudden we got to be programmed to what we say on so [ __ ] socials. Hello. Hello. I'm sorry. I'm 52. I don't

Amy Jeffersgive a [ __ ] man. I don't give a [ __ ] I don't think Andrew is liberal. Okay. I don't give a [ __ ] if he is liberal at all. Conservative. I don't think he's liberal whatsoever. You know what? I should have been on here when Charlie

Amy JeffersKirk was on here. I wish I should. He's literally They have the same views. They're both conservative. I love you, but he's not liberal whatsoever. Well, at any rate,

Carla Letonoises. What the [ __ ] All right. Um, it's an open discussion, right? That got hijacked. Well, a B by definition, a discussion means you have to you speak and you listen. And I don't think And

Carla LetoI've been doing that. I've been silent the whole [ __ ] time. Yeah, but I don't think you know what Andrew's position is. I It doesn't seem like you know what Andrew is even saying. I

Carla Letoresponded to him. But you guys are in agreement and you're responding as if you disagree with him. I do disagree a little bit. A little bit. Have you heard anything about what

Erica Perrywhat could you ever disagree with me on? You did kind of call him liberal and he's literally And I'm not a liberal. Well, I'm not a liberal either. He's actually not liberal. Have you watched the show? You know what? really quick.

Brian AtlasUh Mary, pull up that photo that I pul or actually wait. [ __ ] Ah, hold on. Okay. Sorry. Keep going. I got to fix it. One sec. Keep going. My bad. Keep going. Go ahead. Cheers, Andrew.

Jasmine (Jazz)[Laughter] All right, Andrew. Anyway, everyone, go read my essay. Go read my essay. Rocky's on TikTok. R O C K E Ys linked in the

Jasmine (Jazz)bio. Nobody. It's a short read. It's about six paragraphs. Yes. I wrote it just like randomly. I'm like shocked that any it was ever found. I don't want to read it. Okay. What? Okay. Wait,

Brian Atlasreally quick, Andrew? I want your reaction to this. Um, you I I noticed on your Instagram and are you wearing a cross right now? Yes, I am. Can you show that to the Yes. And this the reason why. Are you a Are you a Christian or

Amy JeffersYes, I am. Okay. And this is very special to me because I got out of rehab for this like 25 years ago. That's fine. Uh, really quick, Mary, pull up the the photo really quick so Andrew can see it.

Brian AtlasYes. Uh, so this is on your Instagram and you have a lot of photos that are just like this. You're always wearing this cross necklace with uh quite a bit of cleavage. Titties be

Brian Atlaspopping out. Titties popping out. Uh, and you also on your Instagram there's a link to your only fans. Uh, this is only fans. What denomination of Christian are you?

Brian AtlasI don't have one. I'm just Christian. I just follow Jesus. Non-denominational. Non-denominational. Uh, one quick question, then I'm going to pass it back over to Andrew. Uh, do you think God

Amy Jefferswants you doing Only Fans? I don't care. I'm on this earth to do what I'm going to do and he accepts me. I I pray every day and Okay. And I pray if he likes it by forgiveness and that's it. And uh, I

Brian Atlasguess a follow-up question. Oops. Let me fix this. Uh, hide that, Mary. Hide the Discord. No, no, no. Here, hold on. Go back. Hide the Discord. Scroll down. Sorry. One. There it is.

Brian AtlasYeah. Uh, okay. If God wants you or is fine with you doing Only Fans, what do you think Satan wants? Um, Satan wants me right

Amy Jefferswhere I where I'm at. Where does God want you? Where I'm going, where I keep doing what I keep doing. My day. Every day. Every day I wake up. I do my thing. No.

Brian Atlasrelated to the sex work. related to the only fans mean sex work. See, when you talk about sex work, am I [ __ ] somebody? What kind of content do you do on your OAF? Is it boy girl? Are there

Amy JeffersNo, it's just me. It's solo content. It's all me. Okay. Whether it's masturbation, whether it's dildos, whether it's naked, whether it's not sex. Would you agree that through your

Amy Jeffersonly fans, you're inducing men to lust? Men are going to lust anyway. It's a natural. But would you be inducing them to lust? Maybe. Well, almost certainly

Brian Atlasyou are probably. Uh, so again, and I I I'm enticing it too on my only fans. How do you Well, okay. Even if you're a non-denominational Christian, how would you reconcile this with your faith? And then again, I'll just ask the question.

Brian AtlasMy faith doesn't come into it. Do you think God wants you to be doing Only Fans? Yes or no? I don't know. What do you think? Do you have a personal Do you have a personal relationship with God?

Amy JeffersGod, it's called He gives us free will and he if we feel good with it and we don't feel anything wrong with it as

Brian Atlaslong as we're not hurting anybody or ourselves and yeah, I think he's cool with it. Isn't there a phrase from the Bible, go and sin no more. So, I mean, God gives you free will, but that's if

Brian Atlasyou go to Jesus and say, I have sinned so badly, just please forgive me. Okay, really quick. Just really quick, then I'm passing it over to Andrew. Well, that's a yes or no. Yes or no? Not an I

Brian Atlasdon't know. Do you think God wants you doing Only Fans? Yes. And then what does Satan want? I don't give a [ __ ] Well, okay. If God wants you to be doing Only Fans, then you would say that Satan

Amy Jeffersdoesn't want you to be doing Only Fans. Just so I have that clear. Maybe. Probably doesn't. That rascally devil. I guess trying to stop. It's called a [ __ ] choice. We

Amy Jefferswere born with a choice. We either do or we don't. Okay? There's either doing or there's no trying in life. There's either trying or doing. Calm down there,

Andrew WilsonMaster Yoda. Calm down. Stop it. No try. Uh, well, there is. I Come on. You ripped that off from Star Wars. You ripped it off from Star Wars.

Brian AtlasYou know what? That little Yoda is a real [ __ ] smart guy, man. Make your point without yelling. Please make your points without I'm sorry. That little Yoda guy is a really smart guy. You can speak impassionately, but try not to

Brian Atlaslike in in terms of your no trying in life only doing uh when you're doing you're trying you. By the way, I want to give uh I have to give credit to Andrew. You must be I have to give credit to uh

Brian AtlasAndrew for that uh argument. The question about what if uh God wants you to be doing Only Fans. Uh and then of course what does Satan want? All credit to Andrew Wilson there. Um, Andrew, I'll pass it over really quick. I did want to

Brian Atlasmake an announcement and Andrew maybe has some thoughts on this. Guys, uh, so Andrew had a fantastic debate with, uh, a woman named Kylie. This was our debate that we had, I believe it was on Sunday

Brian Atlasor excuse me, no, Saturday before our last Sunday show when we had Andrew here in person. Kylie has uh, messaged me and then uh, pull up the Discord so you can

Brian Atlaspull it up. I should have left it on the page. Oh, Kai Kylie has uh threatened me with a lawsuit. Wait, which one was she? Which one? Raqu Kylie. That's the

Brian Atlasnickname I bestowed upon her. Crash out Kylie. Crash out Kylie is her new name. She's She's Can we see her? Yeah, I need to see a visual. Do you have it pulled up on this? Okay. Discord full screen. I

Brian Atlascall her. Yeah, go ahead. Pull it up. Kylie when All right. So, if you guys want to see the messages, you're not going to click on that, but if you want to see the messages, it's in my Discord. Discord.gg/ GG whatever I posted here with the notepad. Sorry. Sorry. I posted

Brian Atlasthe threat that her legal threat. She said she hired a law firm. Uh so a lawsuit is probably imminent from her. Uh I I fully blame Andrew because Andrew

Brian Atlasso thoroughly demolished her worldview that she was so upset that she's really a a poor sport. What's it or a sour what's it called? [ __ ] sore sport.

Brian AtlasSore loser. Sore loser. She's suing me because Andrew just dogwalked her. Wait, what is she suing you for? Like, what's the claim? What's the charge? Yeah, we

Brian Atlasall signed a consent. Well, she's she's alleging that I I being a big stupid beanie head. She's alleging that we harassed her and that we set her up and

Brian Atlasthen there was here's here's the here's the lead lead into this. Uh we were going to cover her airfare and her hotel, right? But she there's a couple components here. She was in breach of

Andrew Wilsoncontract. She got up a whole bunch of times. She wasn't participating. Starting way too far ahead in the story. Listen, go back to when she got to the studio and told you about how she was engaged in a lawsuit with another show.

Amy JeffersWas she that hot? Cuz you paid for it. You said you were going to pay for her to come. That's what I heard. She was like popular on something else. It was a Well, it was a 1 v one debate. So, it's a little different format. she got to

Andrew Wilsonwhen she got to the studio, she wanted Brian to give her all rights over all clips or something like that because she was engaged in a lawsuit against

Andrew Wilsonsomebody and never really described how it was that she was suing them or why something about AI or some something. You remember that, Brian? Yeah. I mean, she was basically like and I've I've

Brian Atlasthis is never a request that would ever be granted, but she this is what she said, Hendrew. He said, "I want to have final approval before any clip that you

Brian Atlaspublish or you push out," which no production company will would ever agree to, at least for like an internet-based production. Uh, so she wanted

Brian Atlasessentially final cut like d uh to to have we would have to be like, "Is it okay if we post this clip? Are you okay with how it was edited?" Nobody does this. This is never granted in any sort

Brian Atlasof production. So, she wanted that. She was like arguing over whether she had to sign the appearance release, mind you, in a prior agreement that we had. It incorporates in that agreement that she has to sign the appearance release. And

Brian Atlasshe's like, "Well, what happens if I don't sign the appearance release?" I'm like, "We can't do the show." And then we do the show there. You guys can watch watch it to see the whole back and forth. She's a bit of a Karen. She

Brian Atlaswalked off a bunch of times. attacked an or well insulted Andrew in various ways and just kind of being a bit of a brat, a bit of a Karen. But the really big thing was where there's a

Brian Atlasdispute here is that as she was about to leave, she said that somebody contacted her, a third party contacted her and offered her

Brian Atlasuh offered her essentially what we were going to pay her for her to walk off and just leave early. Oh, so this would essentially what a good deal. What I guess

Brian Atlasuh so but that then calls into question basically if some third party is interfering with a contract that I had with her and she's benefiting from him

Brian Atlasenticing her to breach her contract with me. I believe on that basis alone, granted there's a lot of her other conduct that I think would constitute breach of contract, excuse me, breach of

Brian Atlascontract, but on the basis alone that she agreed to be paid from a third party to sabotage our production and walk off the set before the agreed upon time and our contract stated she would be paid

Brian Atlasfor her full appearance. that would be breach enough to fully relinquish me of my duty to pay her under the contract that we did have. That's my interpretation. So, she's trying to say

Brian Atlasthat we set her up. Uh she's probably going to say there's defamation. She's going to say some other [ __ ] She's going to say there's breach of contract on her part. Uh she said that this California law firm is going to whatever. So, she's probably going to

Brian Atlasfile a lawsuit. So, if you guys want to support the show, join the Discord. You can see all the legal stuff that I posted. I Oh, I sent her a a scathing

Brian Atlasresponse. Scathing response if you want to see it. So, um yeah. What the [ __ ] is going on back there? The [ __ ] are you doing? What was that? What spilled?

Brian AtlasHello. She was just pushing a bottle into the trash. Oh, why? Okay, it whatever. Um okay. Uh we need to get We got way

Brian Atlasoff course here. We need to get back to this stuff. So, I was asking you, Jazz, you raised your hand for every

Brian Atlassingle thing. How do you reconcile your feminist positions and you your feminist positions almost strictly relate to like not laws or

Brian Atlasanything? It relates to like gender expectations and a rejection of traditional gender roles. yet in your own life you don't hold up to your own

Jasmine (Jazz)sort of relinquishment of gender roles. Yes. So um my focus in education was on

Jasmine (Jazz)political thought and theory. So, um I think I can hold ideas and an ideology that I don't necessarily participate in

Jasmine (Jazz)in the uh present because those circumstances aren't a reality right now. So, um and again, we live in

Jasmine (Jazz)society. Men do exist in a certain way. Women exist in a certain way and have certain roles. We aren't equal physically. So um there is that

Jasmine (Jazz)standard. The standard exists and I am someone that does participate in gender roles but it's just an interest of mine.

Brian AtlasUm like the idea of gender liberation and just political theory was my focus. So but so my question to you is because I I assume that when it comes to like

Brian Atlasthe traditional gender roles or expectations as it relates to women and dating. So you would say for example uh there's certain components that women should be able to escape from like being

Brian Atlassubmissive, right? Or being equal partners and not having the man make all the decisions in the relationship, right? You would you would reject that? I'm I'm assuming. Mhm. Like in your in

Jasmine (Jazz)your own romantic relationships, do you want to be submissive? Um I don't think so. I'm I'm pretty independent and I mean I'm not speaking in sexual terms but pretty dominant too

Jasmine (Jazz)in certain ways. And I think in my personal relationships and this is why I think it's dangerous to perpetuate a certain idea and roles onto people because everyone exists in a bunch of nuances. And in my personal

Jasmine (Jazz)relationships um I would rather just have a partner. So any characteristic that I lack they should have. And if if you're a man who exists as the role of a man in society and you need that

Jasmine (Jazz)counterpart to be a woman who exists as the way women exist in society in that role, then that's your prerogative. Okay. So, how do you believe in gender liberation? Hold on, Mary. Let's get the

Brian Atlascameras going. Okay. Do you believe in gender liberation only for women? No. But okay. If all women, all even feminist progressive women are like you

Brian Atlasin so far as you like say, well, it should be the case that men are allowed to uh maybe men can be stay-at-home dads, but if zero women, especially feminist progressive women, who

Brian Atlasperpetuate that men should be allowed to do this, but none of them actually adhere to it in practice, in reality, then how can men ever explore these other kind of gender dynamics if you

Brian Atlasyourself as a feminist progressive liberal woman, you don't even want that in your own relationship, and I think this would also equally apply to the vast majority of other feminist women who despite their own proclamations of

Brian Atlaswanting gender liberation or gender equity or equality, they still demand chivalry and men paying for dates and men being protectors and providers and all these things in their relationships. You want to escape from your traditional

Brian Atlasgender roles in relationships, but you want to you basically want to be 1950s bachelorettes and still maintain men to their traditional gender roles. How do

Jasmine (Jazz)you explain that? No, I think um everyone should just feel free to exist as they should. And I think perpetuating these roles is dangerous.

Jasmine (Jazz)And although I do look for men who have to protect me physically, I think first it needs to happen on an emotional level where you have a partner who's completely open with you emotionally and

Jasmine (Jazz)maybe matches you intellectually. Um but as it exists today, men are stronger than women physically um most likely. And um okay, so if I go ahead and just

Brian Atlasgrant that fine, it's okay for feminists to want men to be protectors. How about paying for first aids? Yeah, I think when women go out with

Jasmine (Jazz)men, it's a risk because of it's a risk for assault. Let's be honest. 33% of adult women are assaulted by men. So, it's not like it's a rare occurrence. This is a completely dubious statistic.

Brian AtlasYou know, that's just my opinion, though. The statistic is your opinion. No, no, no. My opinion that like if you're already fronting the risk, you know, the stat the statistics you

Brian Atlasreference include, it's really uh it's really kind of a disgusting egregious thing. What they do with these feminist statistics, essentially what they'll do

Brian Atlasis is they'll lump in uh things that are perhaps we would agree like shouldn't be done, but are like not nearly as bad as

Brian Atlaslike full-on violent stranger essay. For example, in these in these studies, they'll include things like cat calling. And they I think that statistic is like way more. It's like nine out of 10 women

Brian Atlasexperience, right? But they'll say, so here's what they'll do. They'll say that uh they'll they'll create like this sort of uh amalgamation category, a c a catch-all category called sexual violence. And in the sexual violence

Brian Atlascategory, they're going to say that things like cat calling uh that falls under it. So when they uh when they give these questionnaires to these women and the women mark well yeah

Brian Atlasthis one time this guy cat called me or if a woman's ever been called a [ __ ] that also is under the uh sexual violence. So it totally skews

Jasmine (Jazz)the statistics. Yeah. I don't know any valid research or academic that would post any sort of um data that would represent cat calling as violence. Sounds like that would be in the

Brian Atlasharassment category, not the violent category. They consider it they consider that category data. Yeah. But if if it is the case that all these feminist institutions and you know, RAIN for

Brian Atlasexample, like that's pretty much the number one uh institution as far as I know that's advocating against SA. Uh and you think they skewer their data? I I've literally pulled like I've actually

Brian Atlaslooked at their statistics and they make the one in three or one in four or one in five claim. And then if you look at the actual it's most of it is from the NIS but they've done other studies too. If you actually look at like the

Brian Atlasquestionnaires that they're sending out to these women, it includes things like have you ever been cat- called? Have you ever been called a [ __ ] And this is considered reputable or is this just like you're saying it's just feminist

Brian Atlasdata points that they're pulling? It's literally what they're siding to these uh like rain. It's the uh studies that they're citing to to come to the

Brian Atlasdetermination that it's been one in four or one in three women are victims of these crimes and then they're just you're going to say, "Oh, it's one in three women are graded." But it's actually no, it's they're in they're

Jasmine (Jazz)fact. I get what you're saying. I just don't know who would consider that to be um if what you're saying is true, who would consider that to be like accurate uh data selection? Uh I can show it to

Jasmine (Jazz)you if you'd like. Um no, I get what you're saying and that is what it's representing. I'm just wondering like there has to be someone who has countered their data and been like this is a a skewed data set and is

Brian Atlasinaccurate. It's the data that these institutions that are uh but it's an inaccurate data set, right? But I mean, if these are like the the talking

Brian Atlaspoints, the well, if these are the ultimate uh organizations that are dictating basically the cultural zeitgeist of one in three women are being essay, but it's including things

Brian Atlaslike cat calling and be like getting called a [ __ ] Yeah, that seems very misleading. Yeah, I would completely agree. Well, Brian's just pointing out that there's a lot of methodological

Andrew Wilsonissues like defining and measuring violence is really difficult because you can only measure it by your definition of what it is. You understand? Like if

Andrew Wilsonif you consider cat calling, for instance, to be sexual violence, then that would skew your numbers extremely high when they're really not as high as you're claiming, right? Um, lifetime

Andrew Wilsonprevalence versus annual violence would be another one. Types of violence, inflated sense of prevalence, right, could be another issue. There's a lot of data biases which happen. When I look at these numbers, I look often at how these

Andrew Wilsonthings are defined and I find massive discrepancies which are absurd. Just absurd. Like the idea of cat calling, for instance, being sexual violence is [ __ ] insane to me. Mhm. I would agree. Uh, I'll get I'm going to let this chat come through then we're going

SPEAKER_05to move it on a little bit. Thank you George. Appreciate it. Share one. Can anyone be what they want? So according to your logic, which other

SPEAKER_05feminists also share? A person can be like Jason Vohees or even Michael Myers. So is mental illness a right? Lolx.

Jasmine (Jazz)Who are those people? Question. I don't know. Um they're asking if I Yeah, if I support like serial killers, maybe. Is that the suggestion? I think that's what he's asking. I mean

Jasmine (Jazz)obviously there's a balance of morality that you have to consider when you are talking in conversations like this and I think murder is morally wrong and I think um academics, anthropologists, political scientists, normal people on

Brian Atlasthe street have all collectively agreed as a society that murder is wrong and serial getting back into the notes here for no it's fine. Um Jazz so like I said there was a bit bit of back and forth.

Brian AtlasYou said that our ideas, so I suppose me and Andrew, our ideas about gender are fundamentally so different that it would be a waste for us to have the conversation that I suppose we are

Brian Atlashaving, have been having, and are about to have. Uh, can you clarify what ideas about gender are fundamental that I I me and Andrew is so fundamentally

Jasmine (Jazz)different? you guys um define gender as biological and I disagree on that baseline. So, we fundamentally disagree on the idea of gender. That's incorrect. Neither Brian

Brian Atlasnor myself would define Oh, what is your definition of gender? Yeah. So, I'll explain. Also, it's nice to meet you. I haven't um seen you. I've seen like a clip recently, but Oh, her so her criticisms were just towards me, I

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