Feminist ACCUSES Him Of MlSOGYNY?! RAGE QUIT?! She Went FERAL?! Andrew Wilson! | Dating Talk #244

Date: 2025-05-26

Duration: 9h 51m

Guests

Brian Atlas

JJasmine (Jazz)>

LLauren Selby >

SSavannah Stone >

JJulie (SPC DT244)>

AAndrew Wilson >

Identified Speakers

SPEAKER_02Erica Perry(guest)

SPEAKER_03Amy Jeffers(guest)

SPEAKER_04Lauren Selby(guest)

SPEAKER_06Andrew Wilson(guest)

SPEAKER_07Julie (SPC DT244)(guest)

SPEAKER_09Brian Atlas(host)

SPEAKER_10Nasica(guest)

SPEAKER_11Carla Leto(guest)

SPEAKER_12Jasmine (Jazz)(guest)

SPEAKER_13Savannah Stone(guest)

Key Moments

IntroAll guests introduced

ControversyJazz: burning misogynistic man could be 'net positive' for society

Key MomentAndrew Wilson joins as call-in guest

Key MomentAndrew donates $3,000 for Savannah Stone honeymoon

ControversyJazz accuses Brian and Andrew of misogyny

OtherAndrew Wilson departs the show

Topics Discussed

Guest Introductions

Including Jazz (feminist), Savannah Stone (married, anti-feminism), Carla Leto (LMFT).

Woman Sets Man on Fire

News article: woman set boyfriend on fire after misogynistic comment.

Feminism/Gender Liberation

Jazz defends feminist views. Accused burning man of being "net positive."

Andrew Wilson Joins

Call-in. Debates Jazz on marriage, commitment, feminism. Donates $3K for Savannah.

Jazz Accuses Misogyny

Directly accuses Brian and Andrew of being misogynistic.

Body Count Discussion

Final topic.

Transcript

Page 3 of 11

Brian Atlasstop that people need to there's not specific advocations towards violence but there is a point where people will

Brian Atlasrespond violently if it relates to even like fairly benign and harmless like microaggressions. So, if I'm understanding what you're saying,

Carla Letoyou're blaming Missandria on her on on her actions, not her poor impulse control, her anger, her uh whatever

Carla Letopsychological disturbances might cause her to respond in an inappropriate violent manner. were blaming Missandrea rhetoric, not her individual inappropriate style of handling

Brian Atlasconflict. Yes. Well, we don't we don't necessarily know the precise reasons, but I would say that the that the fact that she was

Brian Atlasso upset by a what I would consider uh a slightly rude but fairly benign joke. Uh, I don't think a benign joke, even if

Brian Atlaswe are to categorize it as misogynistic, would in any world warrant uh burning somebody alive. Right. You're right. It does not agree. And so, the

Brian Atlasfact that she's so upset by this sort of statement would, I think, further my claim that this is probably due to feminist rhetoric as to like, wo, I'm

Brian Atlasbeing aggressed upon verbally. And you've seen these things when it comes to microaggressions. Uh they are going to categorize it as a form of violence. If you say a thing that is offensive

Brian Atlasthat then gives somebody justification to enact actual physical violence on you. I mean, we've seen this, for example, if you misgender somebody, this

Brian Atlascan sometimes lead to violence on the part of the transgender individual being feeling so agrieved by words that they're now going to become physically aggressive. I'm not saying this happens

Brian Atlasall the time. I just want to be fair, but they feel so agrieved by a verbal utterance that they're now going to uh aggress upon you physically. And in this

Brian Atlascase, she's probably like, "Whoa, the guy. Oh my god, what a misogynist. Misogynists are dangerous. I need to harm him." But these things aren't

Jasmine (Jazz)happening on a grand scale. I think it's a reaction. I think it's a reaction to the injustice. Like, trans people are murdered or kill themselves more often,

Jasmine (Jazz)then they get violent towards someone who misgenders them. You know what I mean? like this is just another instance where you're blaming feminism, but really on a much larger scale, misogyny

Savannah Stoneis the reason a lot of women are dying. Do you not think that that transgender people unal alive themselves more because they're mentally confused and they're they have a mental

Jasmine (Jazz)health issue and they don't know how to You're saying like gender dysphoria? I Yeah, I guess you could call it that. I I would call it That's what it is. Gender dysphoria. That would be the

Jasmine (Jazz)clinical definition. Yes. Yes. Um I think that them not being able to assimilate in society the way that we've structured gender has takes a really large toll on their mental health and

Savannah Stonethat's why their suicide rates are so high. I think the the issue is is when a child or you know a young person what actually whatever age is they go to these therapists and they say hey I have gender dysphoria. I think I'm a woman

Savannah Stonebut I was born a man. that therapist most of the time if they're woke most of them are not not saying you are but I'm saying a lot of them are and they will say okay well you know you're right you

Savannah Stoneshould change into a woman because that will make you happy instead of fixing the actual gender dysphoria because that is a mental illness that should be worked on versus just you know

Jasmine (Jazz)gratifying their their desire to become another gender. I think gender dysphoria only exists. So like this um what it is is like you're born a woman and you

Jasmine (Jazz)don't feel like you exist within the idea of how women exist in society and you feel like a man maybe like internally whatever. I think that

Jasmine (Jazz)distinction only exists because we mclassify gender. So if a woman feels more masculine and relates to more male dominant roles, they get confused

Jasmine (Jazz)because they don't understand that gender is an identity and not biology. That's not true. Well, I think I think your gender is I mean, how would you define a woman?

Jasmine (Jazz)Um, a woman is anyone who identifies with the role of women in society. So, if my husband put on a wig and he decided, I'm a woman today. And he said,

Jasmine (Jazz)"You know what? I'm going to identify as a woman." He's a woman. Um, we can talk these um random situations that just would never happen. That doesn't happen. Nobody decides that they want to be

Jasmine (Jazz)trans and exist in society right now that demonizes being trans. But it doesn't demonize being trans. But no, I think if he felt more feminine and he aligned more with the roles of women in

Savannah Stonesociety and he decided to take that route, then yes, that is a woman. But you can't even say that cuz everybody's got the roles all confused. Like we don't even I mean women women are acting like men now even though they're not

Savannah Stonetrans and men are acting like women. Yeah. And I don't So how can you even say that? Oh, it's because these roles are pushed on us, which like I said earlier, I don't even think traditional roles are being pushed anymore on us. I

Savannah Stonethink it's the opposite. So, how like how can you say, "Oh, well, I'm going to be a woman or I'm going to be a man because I identify with that. So, now I get to go into the women's bathroom as, you know, a a a previous man or what,

Jasmine (Jazz)however you want to word it." Still a man. Still a man. Still a man. Yeah. That's just not the opinion I hold. And no one is transitioning just because they want to use the other gender. No, I think it's

Savannah Stonefor attention. And I think that they have identity issues within themselves because it's like, okay, I am insecure within myself. So, I am going to change into a man because I want attention and I also need to put my identity in

Savannah Stonesomething. And actually, we do live in a society for I would I would say for the most part that does praise the transgender ideology and it praises this mental illness. I I like how do you not agree? It's all

Savannah Stonebeing praised. Why are they killing themselves so much? Because they have a mental illness. They are depressed. And a lot of these people regret it years down the line. A lot. We can look up the statistics.

Carla Letogender actual gender dysphoria is a very small percent of the population and there there are some people who actually grow up feeling what gender dysphoria actually is. I would agree with you your

Carla Letopoint that there are some people who right now in today's society are feeling a variety of things that is not clinical gender dysphoria and it's it's confusion it's trauma it's I'm not comfortable as

Carla Letoa woman because I feel like men are predators so I I think I'll just be a man or that's one example but there are lots of reasons why today a lot of young people are feeling like maybe I'm

Carla Letonon-binary maybe I'm maybe I'm the other I'm the gender that I wasn't assigned with at birth. And you're right, they go

Carla Letoto therapy and I I agree with you that many therapists will instead of explore on a deep level the root of this issue

Carla Letoand is it real gender dysphoria or is it a trauma response or is it confusion? Um I think when it gets endorsed and they're allowed to make that decision at a young age before they develop, it can

Carla Letobe detrimental. And yes, a lot of them do um eventually um regret their decision when they um take hormones and do things. I actually have a client who um went as far as, you know, removing

Carla Letoher breasts and then had to have them put back on later when she realized she made a terrible mistake. And so I'm just saying that um you're you're both right. There is real gender dysphoria, but it's

Carla Letoa very very small percentage right now. There is a phenomenon of people feeling like they have permission to be confused and then do something about it to their

Carla Letobodies. And I think that we should be more responsible in how we respond to that and make sure that that's it's the real very rare case of gender dysphoria

Carla Letoand not all these cases of young people wanting to explore something. And I think that if you feel like a not very feminine woman or a more masculine man, that's great. And I think the point that

Carla Letoyou've been making is people should just be allowed to be themselves. And there is a value in that. There's also value in traditional roles. And I think that

Carla Letoum I think that they both have value. Um and so there's a lot of permission right now to just let people be confused outwardly. And that's where I think

Carla Letowe're getting into we're starting to have um problems and confusion. Um, there's nothing wrong with wanting to be yourself and wanting to be an outlier.

Carla LetoAnd, um, I also think that, you know, the traditional roles have a lot of value, too. They both have value and unfortunately they also contradict each other. Yeah, I completely agree. All

Brian Atlasright, we have a chat here from Rachel Wilson, Andrew Wilson's wife. Chair 2. I'm a firearms instructor. Women often don't have the hand strength to operate the action on an automatic pistol or use

Brian Atlasa spring-loaded magazine. Gun companies pay women big money to represent them on social media. There's no stigma. Thank you, Rachel Wilson, for that chat. Really appreciate it. Reminder, guys,

Brian AtlasAndrew Wilson probably should be joining us here pretty soon. Lucas, good to see you, man. Chair one, using your logic, how would you react if I were to claim that every instance of compuls compulsory culation was a net positive

Brian Atlasbecause it had the potential of ameliorating the birth rate crisis. I feel sorry for the sucker who shacks up with you. You're dangerous. Oh, Jazz is dangerous woman.

Jasmine (Jazz)Okay. You want to respond to that? Um, yeah. My original statement was a joke. That's Oh, it was a joke. It's just a joke. just like the Yeah, there's just there's no way we would know if it was

Brian Atlasin that positive or not. I was just putting a hypothetical out there. Okay. You're you're fine with jokes, though. Um what? You want me in the kitchen? Yeah. No, like if if a man makes like a

Brian Atlassexist joke or I'm not going to do anything about it, but be like, "Come on." But like let's say you were on a date with a guy and he's like I don't know. I don't know what your type is.

Brian AtlasLike it sound like bluehaired, kind of kind of soy. Okay. You'd be shocked. You'd be shocked. Well, I actually, you know, it's funny. I kind of like Yeah. What is your type?

Brian AtlasI I get that you're would you consider yourself leftaning or Yeah. But I have a feeling that you probably see you you encounter a lot of conservative men. Yeah. So, I mean, I'm from the south

Jasmine (Jazz)first off, so that's just the majority of the men I come across. But also, I am very attracted to people who are driven and hardworking and confident. And a lot

Jasmine (Jazz)of times those happen to be like narcissist and again in the area that I am they're most likely conservative as well. So it's just a bad mix all around. Would you say of the guys you've dated what proportion of them completely

Jasmine (Jazz)diverge from you when it comes to like politics? Oh they weren't a boyfriend if we completely disagreed. But I've definitely date like dated for or kept seeing like some and we would have like the reason it went on for however long

Jasmine (Jazz)it did is because we would have like pretty intellectual conversations and we would have these kind of talks with each other you know one-on-one over drinks stuff like that. So I find that like enticing just if anyone's able to like

Brian Atlasopen to talk about things like this. Okay. So you but of the men you've dated perhaps a majority of them have not have not aligned with you politically because of my location. Yeah, because of your location. Okay. I would love to find

Jasmine (Jazz)someone who is there any men out there who read like feminist

Savannah Stoneliteraturon. London the boys are like they're down as [ __ ] them. The also the [ __ ] do liberal men pay for like dates? [ __ ] yes they do. Which gets me into my

Brian Atlasnext thing. Thanks for bringing that up, Savannah. Um, I want to go around the table and we're going to do show of hands from everybody. So, we'll keep it centered here for a moment. Show of

Brian Atlashands. Should men pay for first dates? Is that everybody except for you? Okay. Uh, start with someone else. Show of hands. Should men be protectors from

Brian Atlaseverybody? What does that mean? Protect you. So, uh, yeah. Yeah. From other men. Sure. Yeah. Or what about a woman? Or are you going to throw down with the when? How often are women attacking? I

Erica Perrysee, bro. I see that [ __ ] Yeah. No, these [ __ ] be crazy. She worked in a strip club. I mean, [ __ ] She saw in the right location. I got jumped by so many girls. Like, it's crazy. Oh my god. Yeah, I know, girl. I've never gotten to

Erica Perrya five. You live in Atlanta or sorry, you live in Georgia. Wait. Yeah, Georgia. [ __ ] Yeah, it goes down in Georgia. She's in the south. I'm not in

Erica Perrythe club. Have you ever uh pulled out a girl's weave? Wait, what? Me? Yeah. Have you gone about their hair, Brian? Hair in general. Learn how to

Brian Atlasfight. Hair in general. Um, leave [ __ ] hair. Also, wait. Uh, really quick. Protectors. Men should be protectors. Show of hands. No. Okay. Uh,

Brian Atlasshow of hands. Should men be providers without the Those were shitty ears, too. Being able to Show of hands. Should men open your car door on a first date or

Brian Atlasdates? Yes. Chivalry is good. Is that a thing? Show of hands. Oh [ __ ] Show of hands. Used to be. Should men be chivalous? Yes. Some of these things. You're saying so many terminologies. I don't know. I

Brian Atlasfeel stupid right now. I like actually feel dumb. It's okay. Oh, [ __ ] Like a gentleman. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Show show of hands. Should men observe the sidewalk rule? So, this is when you're

Brian Atlaswalking with your date or girlfriend, wife. The man should typically walk on the side of the sidewalk closest to the street where the cars are. Okay. That's a thing. Show of hands. Who here thinks if you have a boyfriend or husband and

Brian Atlasthen in an instance where only one person can survive, should he sacrifice his life to save you? Yes.

Julie (SPC DT244)I can we should he take the bullet? I think whoever's whoever's able to take an arrow, a bullet, be pushed over a cliff, whatever. Okay. Um, and then so

Brian Atlashold on. Here's where I'm a bit confused, Jazz. Um, and I'm I'm not trying to pick on you, but I think you're probably I'm picked on. You're getting a little bit picked on, but you're the you're It's kind of a more

Brian Atlasconservative panel, I guess. So, uh, of all the first dates you've been on, who paid? Um, the men. Have you ever paid on the first date? I probably have split a tab

Brian Atlasout of kindness on the first date. Yes. Okay. Uh but overwhelmingly majority of the man paid. Yes. Okay. And then when it comes to initiative, like are you making the first move? Like maybe

Brian Atlasapproaching a guy or is the guy almost overwhelmingly the one making the first move? Um. Ooh. I'd say it's pretty even, I think.

Erica PerryOkay. Pretty like first move is like asking them out. Yeah. Yeah. I'd say it's pretty even. Pretty even. Yeah. And uh let's see here. Um they think I'm trolling. I'm not trolling, [ __ ] I'm

Erica Perryjust like this. Anyone who knows me knows that's just that's her. No, I literally No, anyone who knows me knows I'm always sucking on a lollipop. If you see me out in the club, see me anywhere,

Erica PerryI always got a ring pop on me. Oh my god. Who the hell I know cares? Okay. Uh [ __ ] [ __ ] Suck my [ __ ] What the [ __ ] But you

Brian Atlascouldn't cuz you couldn't afford it. What the [ __ ] WTF? You can, by the way, Mary, you're you're able to pull these up. Um, you can you can show the super chats. I don't Oh, it's in the chat. Um, no, this

Brian Atlas[ __ ] thinks I'm trolling. The [ __ ] Uh, and then, um, and then I guess final question for you, Jazz, in terms of physical attraction or Well, we kind of over went over this, but not

Brian Atlasfactoring in like later revealed political positions generally, like do you find conservative or liberal men more attractive?

Jasmine (Jazz)anyone I can talk philosophy with because that's just my uh interest. So I I find that to be pretty even. But like of the liberal men that you do

Brian Atlasencounter, do they measure up in terms of like I I understand for you you like you would probably find it attractive if somebody meshes with you when it comes to your politics, right? like you'd find

Brian Atlasthat uh to be a pro or a benefit. But disregard I guess sort of uh putting that aside well

Brian Atlascomparing the conservative men and the liberal men like would you almost wish that the conservative men weren't conservative because the other characteristics they possess you find

Jasmine (Jazz)those attractive or you just find them more they're just happen to be more physically attractive? Well, maybe not physically attractive, but in the area I live, the liberal men are more artsy and

Jasmine (Jazz)they're driven in a sense, but I like men who go to work and you know what I mean? So, um, most of the time if we're disregarding like political views, um,

Jasmine (Jazz)conservative men usually have the traits outside of politics that interesting that I am attracted to. So yeah, I'm looking for like the perfect mesh of a person that doesn't exist at all. It's

Savannah Stonetough. It's tough out there in Georgia. Uh and so you uh Oh, you live in Georgia. Yeah. Oh, like you still live there? There's so many good men in Georgia. It's such a lie. Oh, you flew out here, [ __ ] Okay. Maybe not the

Brian Atlasliberal. We do live in Atlanta. Bluehaired. Well, sure. But if we're speaking in general, Sure. And uh I think the other thing I was going to ask was uh can I I just can you reconcile

Brian Atlasbecause when you were discussing what feminism is you're like well as it relates to feminism uh you think that pretty much across the board men and women have equal rights at least as

Jasmine (Jazz)bestowed upon them by the government. Um you you don't think men and women have equal rights? Well, at the moment, um, Roie Wade was turned over federally. So, that's a law that has control over

Jasmine (Jazz)women's bodily autonomy, and there is no law that controls men's choice over their body. So, I think that's a discrepancy. Actually, men also can't get pregnant, actually. So, hold on. Uh, there's three things I'm going to I'll

Amy Jeffersgive you here. It went right back where it was supposed to go. Back to the States. That's where it's supposed to go. It's true. Right back where it's supposed to go. and it was enacted the

Brian Atlasyear I was born 197. I think it's important to set federal precedents for things. It wasn't as important as that. So I guess my my count here would be um one as it relates to reproductive rights, men don't have any reproductive

Brian Atlasrights. So in terms of there being a comparative inequality between men and women, I would actually say that if you wanted equality between men and women and that was your stated goal despite

Brian Atlasperhaps what women want or female advocacy, you would actually have to entirely roll back abortion rights completely for there to be a semblance of equality between men and women

Brian Atlasbecause men have no reproductive rights. Air go. Equality would dictate women should have no reproductive rights. Also, I know that that wouldn't be what women want, but that would actually create equality. Well, not necessarily

Jasmine (Jazz)because women are the only one in the equation that can give birth. I agree with you. I agree with you. But if we're doing a comparison, men don't ever have to make the choice of if they should hold a baby in their stomach or not.

Jasmine (Jazz)Yeah, sure. I agree with that. So, the reason that women should be allowed to choose is because they will be holding the baby, whereas the men don't have that option. Therefore, there isn't a

Brian Atlaslaw to I agree with you to the degree that yes, you're right. Only women Well, I don't know if Well, depends on your people with uterus. Sure. Well, that's your your words, not mine. Uh I agree

Brian Atlaswith you. Yes, only women can get pregnant. Uh but again, if we're doing a comparison when it comes to well, what rights do men have that women don't? Again, I would just say if we're doing a

Brian Atlascomparison of equality between men and women, you would not be able to say that uh it's something that uniquely impacts women. But I if we're doing a comparison of rights between men and women, I'm

Brian Atlassaying we're fairly equal on paper. Sure. Sure. Okay. So, but your position was more so geared Yeah. So, we'll just move on to that. Your position was more so geared towards Oh, wait, hold on. There's one other thing I want to say.

Brian AtlasUh you said men don't have any constraints on their bodily autonomy. Uh this is actually state down so that I'll give you three examples. Uh I mentioned

Brian Atlasthis before for well circumcision I prefer to call it uh infant genital mutilation. I'd agree. Well infant male genital mutilation because uh baby girls

Brian Atlasare not don't have their genitals mutilated in the United States. Uh there's maybe like some I don't know if it's like under Islamic even then I'm pretty sure it's outlawed in the United States anyways. Um, so this would be

Brian Atlasevidence of baby boys not being able to give their informed consent to have their genitals mutilated upon birth. But there is an option. The parents hold the option. It is normalized that it does

Jasmine (Jazz)get cut. It usually gets cut without asking, but there is the option. So there is the choice. I would say it's systemic in the sense that if it were illegal that would be the issue and that would be an equal discrepancy that you

Brian Atlasguys but I would argue that there's no law which I think there should be pre preventing this barbaric and out there practice I would agree then and so I think there ought to be a law that is uh

Brian Atlaschoice no no there's no choice oh that you can't snip I don't care what your religion is you can't mutilate the genitals of a a baby boy that's my position I don't care what religion is

Brian Atlasthere's no religious grant. I think this is a barbaric practice. Yeah, I agree. I don't think the health standard exists either. I don't think it's Well, and I also think it's systemic too because the entire health care system is systemic.

Brian AtlasYou have uh an abundance of female pediatricians that are performing this thing. You have single mothers who are uh who are opting choosing to have their baby boys have their uh be circumcised.

Brian AtlasAnd then you have like a cultural and social phenomenon which kind of relates I mean there's like this argument about like it's healthier and cleaner and more hygienic. There's some disputes there.

Brian AtlasThere's clearly other countries where there's not circumcision and you can you can clean, you know, the penis without the need for that. But the other

Brian Atlascomponent here would be like women's own stated dating preferences once they become adults is like well I prefer so what what impact does that have socially and culturally where women have a really

Brian Atlasstrong preference genital preference for men who are circumcised and I would say that that's like another factor there but that relates to bodily autonomy. Second thing I would argue is forced

Brian Atlasmilitary conscription. The draft that's clearly the state down saying uh men you can be ultimately sent off to some

Brian Atlasforeign country or if it in the event of like an invasion I suppose whatever you could be sent to go and die effectively or be harmed or go to war. That would be taking away men's bodily autonomy.

Brian AtlasFurther if men don't register for the selective service they can be well there's a whole bunch. They can't vote. They lose out on certain uh federal jobs, uh certain

Brian Atlasfederal aid, they lose out. Uh there's it's technically a felony, $250,000 fine. So, there's all kinds of negative So, you're against any laws that restrict male bodily

Brian Atlasautonomy, like being sent to the draft. Uh I'm against circumcision, the draft. I think war bad, but also war is just

Brian Atlasgoing to be unless there's some sort of like total massive shift in like uh like a technological singularity where like the world we live in 50 years from now is like so far beyond this would

Brian Atlasprobably happen through AI or like advancements in technology so far beyond what our human mind can even comprehend that war has just completely been eradicated. I don't think that'll be on

Brian Atlasthe scale of 50 years, but I would say that uh as it currently stands, war is an inevitability. And so there are circumstances where I don't think it

Brian Atlasshould be the case as a male advocate that uh men should be subject to war and war is a specifically gendered male grievance. But it just is sort of a

Brian Atlasreality that nations nations and countries are not going to uh are not going to reject their ability to call upon citizenry in the event of like an

Brian Atlasinvasion or war. Yes, they're the nations are going to reserve their right to force men to fight. Go ahead. I just have to have something to add about war. Okay.

Amy JeffersMy father who was not drafted into Vietnam for one reason and it was funny because we were right after dinner. We were talking about it and I have two other sisters and my dad,

Amy Jeffershe never had anything to drink at dinner and still he had his milk right after dinner and he was standing at the sink and we're like, "Yeah, dad, why weren't you drafted?" Well, he was like, "My

Amy Jeffersballs were too big." Yeah, I guess bone spurs is a thing. And I guess having balls that are too big is a thing, too. I don't know.

Amy JeffersI've never seen my dad's balls, but [ __ ] right? [ __ ] [ __ ] Yeah. [ __ ] man. [ __ ] is right. That's crazy, son. Yeah. [ __ ] Somebody's balls are too big

Amy Jeffersto get into military. There you go. Or be drafted. So, there it is. Just like Trump with his bone spurs. It's true. And a ball's too big is also freaking

Amy Jefferstrue. Your your dad had my father has got elephant and of course he's the one with prostate cancer. So but he's he didn't get the he's not neutered. He's not neutered. He's not neutered like

Brian Atlasthat. He just got the prostate removed. But yeah. Okay. Um and then look my final point here is when it comes to the uh men lacking bodily autonomy

Brian Atlasuh in the event of uh so for example if uh the the state can force men to work and so we've done away I think in the 18th century or maybe it was the early

Brian Atlas19th century I forgot the exact date we we did away with uh with debtor's prisons so if you have a debt to somebody they used to be able to send you to prison right correct no longer can you be sent to prison for a debt

Brian AtlasNope. Except as a man if you owe child support to a woman. Now again to be fair, she requests she can request it. I Hold on.

Brian AtlasSo this is genderneutral. To be fair, a woman who's had behind on her child support could arguably also be sent to prison. Although I would argue first off the majority of child support, I think

Brian Atlasit's 93% goes in the direction of men to women. So it impacts some women, but it's overwhelmingly men. In the same way that you might argue that like essay, we would agree that men are also victims of

Brian Atlasessay, but you would probably say this impacts women more because they're uh they're more likely to be uh victim or whatever. So in this case, uh that would be another example of men lacking bodily

Brian Atlasautonomy because the government can basically say, for example, and it could be it could be under like really kind of shitty circumstances like for example, a female teacher could essay one of her

Brian Atlasunderage students and she could get pregnant by that student where essentially she graded him and then she gets pregnant. the state can then force that ch that child to uh pay child

Brian Atlassupport to her despite one there being a crime that occurred and uh so forth. So that's kind of an extreme example, but another example that's probably a bit more frequent there. There's a couple maybe they're in a situation do you

Brian Atlassupport male bodily autonomy or do you not? Well, hold on. I'll get to that. So the more realistic example might be like a you know there's a boyfriend and girlfriend or a situationship they're

Brian Atlassleeping together but the guy is not wanting to have a child and she gets pregnant. She unilaterally chooses to keep the child because women can do that. They can choose to get an abortion and the man can't do anything. They can choose to

Brian Atlaskeep the child. The man can't do anything. He can't opt out. So the so the men can essentially be forced into fatherhood and basically be debt slaves

Brian Atlasuh for 18 plus years or sometimes even up to 21 plus years depending on the state. So um I'm in favor of male bodily autonomy. Yes. Okay. Yeah. I find it funny that

Jasmine (Jazz)you're in favor of male bodily autonomy but not women's. When did you didn't even hear my position on I did on abortion. What's my position on? Oh go ahead then. Are you pro-life or pro-choice? Uh, well, you know, it's

Brian Atlasreally hard to say on that one. I would say or just say if you support women's autonomy. I would I would say that uh there are very compelling arguments for the pro-life side. So, I I'll go ahead and I'll just go ahead and say yeah,

Brian Atlaspro-life. However, what I am going to say is I would say that if I'm looking at the current state of affairs descriptively, there are states where women retain the right to have an abortion. for example, California, women

Brian Atlascan have an abortion in the state of California. My argument from men's rights perspective is in any state because I'm just working with like within the current system, right? So, it

Brian Atlaswould be a fair proposition if abortion was completely outlawed, then yes, if a man gets a woman pregnant despite him not wanting to be a father, he's on the

Brian Atlashook for child support. Sure. But in states where women secure the right and retain the right to have an abortion, men should have a corresponding right to

Brian Atlasuh called legal paternal surrender, men in the same way that women can murder their unborn children, men should be able to walk away and essentially sever their relationship if they so choose.

Brian AtlasThey shouldn't obviously they can't force the woman to get an abortion. But in states where there's abortion rights, men should have some corresponding legal paternal surrender where they can say, "Well, I don't want to be a father. I don't want the paternal responsibility.

Brian AtlasI don't want to be financially responsible." In the same way you would probably say a woman who doesn't isn't ready to be a mother or isn't financially ready to raise a child, you would say that would be a justified reason to have an abortion. So too

Brian Atlasshould it be the case that men should be able to escape uh responsibility uh yeah from child support or any sort of paternal responsibility. Yeah. I

Jasmine (Jazz)think gender specific laws um like you're suggesting that men have to take care of a child that they maybe don't want because the woman wants it um is unfair. Sure. Can I add something? Sure.

Savannah StoneUh, I think we've we've come to a point in in society where nobody wants to take responsibility for their actions. And every time you have sex, no matter what contraceptive you're on, they're not all 100%. You are risking a possible

Savannah Stonepregnancy. So, every time you have sex, you have to be okay with the fact that there's, you know, a 5 to 10% chance that I could get pregnant having sex. But the problem is, nobody wants to take

Savannah Stoneresponsibility for their actions. So, everyone's using abortion as birth control, right? And I don't even agree with the fact that a father should be able to walk away from a mom and let her struggle and be a single mom and not pay child support. I think when you when you

Savannah Stonetake that action when you have sex, you should therefore have the responsibility of that child because your actions have consequences. You don't believe in abortion? No, I don't believe in

Jasmine (Jazz)abortion. But like what if she's saying like when two people have sex, there is always a percentage. You're assuming a risk no matter what. Yeah, you're assuming a risk, but if you simply don't have the resources to take care of a

Erica Perrychild, then you make it work. You sacrifice. Really? But what if that child has a terrible life? Exactly. And what if the baby daddy is like actually criminally horrible? Wouldn't a terrible Wouldn't it be worse to murder the child

Jasmine (Jazz)than to give it a chance? How is it murdering if it's like in the beginning stages of it's a life? You believe like life science kids can have bad lives.

Amy JeffersIt just depends on how you want to treat your kids, man. You got you got moms and dads that are married and they treat their kids like [ __ ] So, if a kid turns out bad, well, it can be a lot of factors, but you don't have to keep Let

Erica Perryme give an example for you. So, I had a friend, this man who got her pregnant, told her she was going to be a terrible mother. She was not going to be a terrible mother. He just like totally brought her down. He he said he didn't want to be in the child's life. She ba

Erica Perryhe basically forced her to get an abortion. Like what do you say in that circumstance? So he can't force a woman to get an abortion. It's He basically did. He said, "I don't want to be part of the child's life. I'm not going to be a part of this." Like so what do you say to that girl that has no means? He

Erica Perrydidn't force her. He's just saying I'm not going to pay. But what do you say to a girl that has no means to provide for that child who like I say you figure it out. How so? Do you have a two parent household? What do you mean? Like my You

Jasmine (Jazz)have a mom and dad? I do. So you don't you don't understand. You don't understand because you have not been in that circumstance. Poverty is also a cycle. So, if you already lack resources and you feel like you can't take care of

Savannah Stonea child, you have a job. There are over 3,000 pregnancy resources in America. There's over 3,000 pregnancy resources. We live in such an individualistic society where everybody is like, "Oh my gosh, what's going to happen to me?"

Savannah StoneLike, I it's we live in a really selfish society. So, when someone gets pregnant and there's like, "Oh, well, I can't financially afford this child. I can't take responsibility for my actions, so I'm just going to kill it." that you're

Erica Perrygiving the child a worse life by killing it than bringing it into this world and figuring it out. Most children that come out of that type of circumstance don't really have a great grand to see a statistic on that. I I don't have a

Savannah Stonestatistic. I have friends that come from that circumstance and I feel like you haven't like where where were you raised? Why does Why does that matter? Because it does matter. You're No, no, no, no. You're trying to be condescending because Oh, it's not condescending, baby. It's it's just

Savannah Stonestraight up forward. Do you know do you know who gets the most abortions? So what's your statistic? I'd love to hear black women and they get them over and over again as birth because of lack of education and resources. Lack of educa.

Savannah StoneEverybody knows sex produces a child. That is like I knew that at 5 years old if I have sex. I'm glad you knew that that you were well educated on sex and reproduction.

Jasmine (Jazz)Like well educated systems are based on the funding is based on property taxes. So, if you live in section 8 or lower income housing, your schooling isn't funded as much. I didn't learn. And aren't liberal places have the most

Erica Perrylearn from? I'd love to know. I thought liberal places, liberal bastions have the most two party household. Yeah. A lot of people don't come from a two-party household. They come from broken families and that's like the majority. So, you're saying that's why

Jasmine (Jazz)you're saying they should kill their child if they believe it's murder. It's not murder. If it's in the beginning stages, how is it not murder? I don't cuz life doesn't begin at conception. Yes, it does. Science has proven that. The Bible proves it. The Bible, we're

Amy Jeffersnot debating the Bible. We're not in a religious debate, baby. It doesn't matter. That 6 weeks is the first time that the nerve. We're just having a conversation that's non-biblical. Oh, you know, there is a light that

Amy Jeffershappens when the sperm meets the egg. If actually, anybody wants to find out if life happens. It actually And you know what? A woman can feel it. I know I felt it when I got pregnant with my daughter. And why? It's because it's calcium

Amy Jefferssulfate mixed with magnesium. Okay? feel when a guy nuts in me does that conception is the is the calcium sulfate and the and the sperm is the magnesium I feel when a guy nuts in my mouth is that conception I literally

Jasmine (Jazz)feel it's just like it's straight up I think you're very like calcium and magnesium combining create and it does it creates creates a bang in the uterus

Julie (SPC DT244)a light of conception it called the zinc spark you can feel it so women feel it I will agree with what you said about um the environment at home not being right

Julie (SPC DT244)right to bring a child into the world. I do agree with that. But we do have the option and and granted I I think I used to have a different view but and I agree

Julie (SPC DT244)I used to be believe the way you did so oh it's not a baby yet. Um but I believe but I believe differently now and and

Julie (SPC DT244)yes it may be not desirable to carry a baby around for 9 10 months but you do have the option of giving that baby up for adoption. I don't think that's an argument that we can come back to it

Brian Atlascome back to it later time permitting. Uh really quick some chats and I think we're going to get Andrew here in just a moment. Cat Spencer that with a 100 British pounds. Thank you. Or wait is that the Yeah. Okay. I'd like to remind

Brian Atlaswomen that men made laws to protect them and those lucky enough to be born in the West should be grateful. It doesn't follow Abrahamic law. Feminism exists because men allow it. From cat Spencer,

SPEAKER_05thank you for your super chat. Appreciate it very much. Then we have Chef Dill Pickles here. Uh-oh. Chef Dill Pickles donated

SPEAKER_05$200. Life begins at conception. Cope harder. Who? Cope harder. I love that word. Love it. Wait, where is I like beer league

Brian Atlashooers. She was a whoa. Yes, she was a whoa. Yep, it's true. All right. Uh, thank you for that, Chef Dill Pickles. Good to see you in the chat, man. Uh, he

Brian Atlashas a followup and he says, "Chair 2, what substance are you on tonight?" I'm on life, baby. This is me all day, every

Erica Perryday. Anxiety. Anxiety. It's I have like the most high strong anxiety. Okay, but if you were wondering, it's Lo. No preservatives, no additives. We

Brian Atlasdon't do tequila that has chemicals in it. Gross word. Okay. Uh Clay, chair one is a victim of idiocy, also a victim of woke culture. Chair 2 has an obvious. I

Brian Atlasdo. Oh my god, I have an oral fixation. Thank you, baby. Okay, chair two or chair seven. Love your arguments. Where is Andrew? Need some more decent arguments. Uh he's I

Brian Atlasthink we're going to get pulled up here in just a moment. Uh, thank you, CLA. Honestly, you're valid. And uh, let's see here. Well, chair seven's You're married. Yeah, but she

Erica Perryhas a book, but she's a psychiatrist. She's like an act therapist. Oh, okay. I thought he was hitting on you, but no, he's just saying he loves your arguments. Thank you. I appreciate it. She's a book, too, everybody. Check out

Brian Atlasher book. Thanks, girl. All right. I'm going to go back there uh in just a sec. Wait, Felicia, are you able to just take my seat for a moment while I uh Oh, you're getting some water. Okay. Uh once you're back, I'll have you just take my

Brian Atlasseat and then we'll uh we'll get Andrew pulled up. Andrew, thank you. I'm going to have to use the restroom before Andrew. I like actually just wait though. Somebody's there. Thanks for the super chat. Appreciate it. Appreciate it. Here, while I'm just waiting on

Brian Atlasthat, let me see if there's anything we needed to get into here. Uh I'll do one quick note before we get Andrew pulled up. What is it? Uh, actually, we'll come back to it. Uh, okay guys, if you can

Savannah Stonetalk amongst yourselves, I don't know if you had another question for them. I just want to keep going on the abortion argument. Oh, we're going to keep going. Well, I don't think we ever got got to like a con. I don't I don't think there's ever like an actual conclusion

Erica Perrywith the abortion argument because there's such a differentiation or whatever like between is that the word? Differentiation. So, I'm not really We're just not We're not We're never going to agree. No. Yeah, of course. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot. Have you had

Erica Perryan abortion before? No. I'm [ __ ] with you. I know you haven't. Have you? No, I've not. But I have friends who have and they were in really bad circumstances and like I saw from their

Erica Perryperspective what they went through. And before I had a different um viewpoint and then I saw what they went through, I was like, "Wow." Like I I understand now. Do they regret their abortions? No.

Erica PerryWhy would they regret it? Because 90% of women regret their abortions. No. the baby like it was not going to have a good life. Like the baby was not so we just kill it. It doesn't have a good

Nasicalife. Like you can't just eliminate their life based on chance. Have you had an abortion? No. Do you know anyone who has everybody? I actually do know somebody. And if you've had an abortion Yeah. Let's raise our hand. Brian, how

Jasmine (Jazz)many have you had to really cover the cost of? I I don't know. Brian, have you have I been pregnant? Yes. Yes. Have you been pregnant, Ryan? I just want to say

Jasmine (Jazz)there's a pregnant there's a lot of um discourse in academia of how much we should consider morality and religion when it comes to creating um or having

Jasmine (Jazz)these discussions but when it comes particularly to creating policy. So these conversations are important because there are people who believe there is religious backing and moral backing to why there should be a law or

Amy Jeffersthere's other people who and let's look at who's making these stupid ass bag policies in Washington right now. Yeah. No, I wouldn't trust any of these [ __ ]

Nasicabags making [ __ ] policy at all. At all at all. Abortion can damage your body. And I have a friend who had had done it and

Nasicanow she can't have a baby at all. How long did she like wait to have the abortion? I'm not sure, but she's had it like two times and she can never have a baby at all and she wanted children. Interesting. So, what do you have to say

Jasmine (Jazz)about that? I wonder what the statistics are on how often someone becomes unable to bear children after an abortion. I also wonder if it's a safe abortion. If it's a safe abortion, usually there's no issue with um conceiving after. I don't

Lauren Selbyknow the statistics, though. I do think it's rare, but that is very sad. Since I've had one, I will say I was very young. Of course, I was not in the position to I made bad decisions. I

Lauren Selbychose to take the pill, go home, and pass it. And it was very traumatizing. I bled everywhere, and it was gnarly. I I

Lauren Selbycan't say that I regret it because again like some people maybe think that child would probably not have a decent life even though I would have

Lauren Selbymade it work if I would had had it. But I have had a child and he's healthy and it just it was just you know 20 years ago it was different and it was just a

Lauren Selbydecision and I can't go back and that's it. I'm not going. Would you have chang you wouldn't have changed your mind if you were back then like knowing what you know now. No, I I don't I I made a

Erica Perrydecision and I stick with it and that's that's it is what it is. That's how I feel. I feel like when you make a decision, you make a decision. You shouldn't like I understand the morality of it

Julie (SPC DT244)like you're going to go to hell. Um you're killing somebody. But but even if we take religion out of it, you were mentioning um uh removing religion and morality out of Oh, Andrew's here. I had

Jasmine (Jazz)to go pee. Law. Yeah. Right. Well, no, not removing it. It's just there is conversation of how much of morality and religion should we consider when we create policy. But I think I I I think

Jasmine (Jazz)if we're not considering morality then what are why no we are. It's just to what extent do we think oh what if this child cured cancer. It's like that debate whereas we're we could

Jasmine (Jazz)realistically look at the position the woman is in now and if it would benefit her life or if it would benefit the child's life. So, it's just kind of this balance of morals and religion and and literature and academia and just having these discussions. It's I think it's a

Julie (SPC DT244)balance. I don't think we should remove morality. I think there should just be a level of it to consider. And now, now that I'm thinking about that, I guess I guess I couldn't really pose that question because I have other views that

Julie (SPC DT244)potentially would go against morality. So, I'm considering especially when it comes to like so subjective. It's more so I'm thinking about crime and I don't think murder is subjective. I think that's

Savannah Stonepretty like well we have a different opinion on if it's murder. Okay. So why why when a pregnant woman gets shot or killed why is it a double homicide because it wasn't her choice. That makes that literally makes no

Jasmine (Jazz)sense. If she was trying to carry that literally makes no sense. If she wanted to carry that child to a human being then yes it is double homicide. That's a good question. Is that it's still it's

Jasmine (Jazz)but it's still like a child choice. If she wanted to bear the child, so what? Well, she's a human. Think so. If I think in my head about killing somebody, am I murdering them?

Andrew WilsonNo. Okay. No. Right. So, if it's not a life by your standard, how could it be murder regardless if she was wanting to carry Hang on. Hang on. Regardless of

Andrew Wilsonthe intention of the mom, how in the world could it be murder just based on her intention? That's the dumbest [ __ ] thing I've ever heard in my life. Can you explain that to me,

Jasmine (Jazz)please? Like, use really small words. Um, if she was trying to carry that child to birth, Yeah. and that option was taken from her because she was murdered and therefore it it killed the

Jasmine (Jazz)baby, then that's a double. That's not a baby though by your standard, right? Um I guess it depends um when she was but again it's a senseless murder and if she wanted to carry it to full term then it

Jasmine (Jazz)would have been a child abate by your standards. Is that correct? At what point like 6 weeks like four weeks whatever the point is where you think it's not a if she hadn't decided to have

Andrew Wilsonan abortion and she wanted to for what her decision doesn't matter here. We just have different opinions because I'm there's no difference of opinion. We're just doing a logical consistency check.

Andrew WilsonWhat's the cut off for you? A woman. So woman, right? Whether or not it is the case that she wants to have the abortion or not have the abortion from your view, is that a baby or not a baby?

Jasmine (Jazz)Do do we have like the Jeopardy theme song? I don't I just don't know how to answer your question. So, well, what at what term do you think of an abortion? Hang on, hang on, hang on. Even if you

Jasmine (Jazz)don't know how to answer the question, is the thing inside the woman's belly a baby or not? So, even if she were murdered before what I consider to be a

Jasmine (Jazz)life of a child, which is I think legally it's like 6 weeks. You can have an abortion if it's up to 6 weeks. So even if she were murdered at the 3-w week mark, the four-week mark, if she

Andrew Wilsonher plan was to carry that child and bear that child, then I do think yes, that's that's the reason it's double. That doesn't make any sense. Is that child from your view an actual baby or

Jasmine (Jazz)not? No, not before 6 weeks. Then why would it be murder? Because the senseless action if that didn't happen, it she got murdered. Yes. But if that didn't happen, she would have had a baby.

Andrew WilsonYeah. Okay. So, you're just you're making a case against abortion. If she hadn't had an abortion, she also would have had a baby, right? So, she's a murderer by your logic.

Andrew WilsonOkay. Like I I That's your logic like that. So, here's your logic. If it is the case that the woman intended to have the baby, she would have had the baby. Should I have the opinion that it shouldn't be a If it is the case that

Andrew Wilsonhang on, but if it is the case that the woman aborts the child before it comes to term, then that's murder. And we know it's murder because if if she's murdered with the baby in her womb, even if it's

Jasmine (Jazz)before when you consider it to be a baby, you consider that murder because the baby's not brought all the way to term. So no matter what, from your view, abortion would be perfect. So you think my stance should be that it shouldn't be considered a double homicide. That would

Jasmine (Jazz)be me aligning with my own stance. Yeah, that would be at least the consistent stance. Um, sure. That would be the consistent stance, but I just think there's more nuance to it. I think if it What's the nuance? Like how do you how

Andrew Wilsondo you intend something to be alive or not? It either is alive and it is the thing or it's not. You don't like I can't like in so like could I be like you you know you killed the chair you

Andrew Wilsonknow because my intention is that the chair is alive. That's just that that's that's not factual though, right? The chair isn't actually alive. So you can't murder the chair from your view. This is not a baby. So there how could the guy

Jasmine (Jazz)be charged for two homicides? That makes no sense. I'll I'll fix my stance and say that if it's after 6 weeks then then it should be a double homicide charge. If you if that makes you feel better

Jasmine (Jazz)about able to have abortions after 6 weeks. I'm you're asking if we should be able to have abortions past 6 weeks. No. So now I'm changing my stance from the

Andrew Wilsondumble homicide that if it's prior to 6 weeks if you want my right argument to women should not so women should not be allowed to have abortions past 6 weeks.

Jasmine (Jazz)That's a heavy debate. So I Well, no, it's just an internal in this case, it's just consistency. Well, it's heavily debated um at what point because a lot of women don't know until the 6 week

Andrew Wilsonmark and then they don't have the time to make a choice. But I mean, I'm not a biologist. When you when you do like a meta thing, when you when you give commentary about the status of something, it's kind of

Andrew Wilsonactually irrelevant to the question. So like if I go uh you know, how's the weather outside? and you go, "Well, that's heavily debated." It's like, "I'm not asking." Well, I'm letting you know that I don't have a specific Hang on. I'm not asking you what Jim Paul and

Jasmine (Jazz)Chuck think. I'm asking you what you think, right? So, is it murder after 6 weeks or isn't it? I don't necessarily have an opinion on that. I think there's discrepancies. Yeah. Brian didn't give

Jasmine (Jazz)his opinion on if he was pro-choice or pro-life. He said both sides had or pro-life had a lot of information that he agreed with as well. though. I mean, you can afford you can hold double. You can Yeah, I understand that's Brian's

Andrew Wilsonposition. Okay. In my position, you But when you make a stance that you say something is murder, then you're giving us a value for life. So, if that's the case, then you must think that there's value that this is an actual life past 6

Andrew Wilsonweeks at least. Right. Sure. Yeah. So, I mean, if that's the case, then you would at least have to admit that if a woman has an abortion after the 6 week mark, she is actually

Jasmine (Jazz)killing the baby. Yes. I I think there's scientific backing that um life begins at around 6 weeks because of neurons or nerve endings or something like that. I'm not again I'm not consciousness or

Jasmine (Jazz)something like that. I get it. I'm just not well versed on this topic. Uh I just listen to the scientists and think if that's the cut off that they think is um allowable and not extremely immoral then

Jasmine (Jazz)well scientists don't determine morality. Yeah. I mean, it's just all opinions at the end of the day, but le legally it's the six week mark. Yeah. So, all all science scientific consensus is that life begins at conception.

Andrew WilsonThat's that's not refutable. That's a human life at conception. I promise I'll tell you what, I'll make a deal with you right now. Bet you 100 bucks. If you look up right now scientific consensus of when life human life begins, it will

Jasmine (Jazz)say at conception. I'll bet you I'll bet you right now if you think I'm wrong. I believe you. I was just under the impression that that was a religious um sentiment. No, that's the scientific

Andrew Wilsonconsensus is that human I mean it would have to be right. That's that's when there's basically new DNA. That's that's that it would have to be categorized as

Jasmine (Jazz)human life. So that's when scientists via consensus think human life begins. Just saying. So does that change your stance? Not necessarily because again

Jasmine (Jazz)they have the six week benchmark for some reason. I think it's when the the child at that point has like

Jasmine (Jazz)more like autonomy and ability than previously before that makes it more lifelike. I'm not I again I don't know the science behind this. I'm not the one to argue this point. Well, there is no

Andrew Wilsonthese are not scientific claims like the the moral implications of abortion. Those aren't questions that science can answer. They could maybe give us an idea of when consciousness begins or when life begins or things like that, but

Andrew Wilsonscience isn't in the business of giving us any type of ought claims. They're just only interested in descriptors really. But no, that this is how thing works, right? Like science could tell us how a

Andrew Wilsonnuclear bomb works, but couldn't tell us when we're supposed to use one.

Brian AtlasWelcome, Andrew. Welcome. Good to see you, man. Uh, I'm going to let one chat come through then. Uh, we're going to get right into some really good stuff.

SPEAKER_05Clay, thank you for the $200. $200. I will never jump into your DMs. I've tried to change a woman before.

SPEAKER_05House, rebuild a car, cook, and fly jets. I also open doors and pay for nights out. Dot. I'm not taking on another project. Yo, Colleen, thank you for the TTS. I

Brian Atlasreally appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. All right. So, uh, and Andrew, do you have a what's your heart out for tonight or you want to just go? Well, I started I started late. We'll just see how it goes. Okay. Sweet. We'll see how

Brian Atlasit goes. Uh, since Andrew does have some limited time though, there were two people on the panel who kind of wanted to uh well had perhaps specific notes for them. So, there's other things we're going to get to a little later on in the

Brian Atlasshow, but we're going to focus on those for now. Um, I'm going to jump to you briefly because you wanted to specifically talk to Andrew, but then Jazz, you had some notes that were

Brian Atlasdirected kind of at both me and Andrew. So, uh, I won't remember mine off off. By the way, to the panel, uh, it's nice to meet you all. My name is Andrew Wilson. Hi, Andrew. Andrew, like, you

Andrew Wilsonlook very well groomed tonight. I was a little late um because I was catching up on my beauty sleep, as you can see. I definitely need more of that. So, um, but that's that's why I was a little

Erica Perrylate. You look great. What are you talking about? Agreed. But I could look even greater. No, he shaved his beard. Yeah, you shaved it up. You were looking a little rough last week on the like the the debates. Yeah, I was looking a little

Erica Perryhomeless. I agree. I wish you were here. We would have had a show out together. She brought tequila. I know. I was looking for I I genuinely thought you were going to be here. I was like, [ __ ] Wait, no. It's like vodka next time. No, I brought Lala with no preservatives,

Brian Atlasadditives. All right. So, uh, Julie, you said that, let me see. Let me look at the notes. I mean, I'm going to drink it. I'm not going to lie. I know you would have. I'm not. You are low-key a den just like

Erica PerryI am, but not in like the extremity I am, but like in other other ways. The gluttonous way. I'm not a glutton. Um, so to drink to get drunk is gluttony. I don't drink to

Andrew Wilsonget drunk. I drink in celebratory usually the purpose of celebration or sometimes it'll be to calm my nerves or things like that button actually I don't

Andrew Wilsonactually seek out um drinking to get drunk at least not often. Maybe if I'm at like a friend's wedding or something like that I'll be like hey we're going to get wrecked tonight um on a special occasion or something like that. But

Erica Perrythose are pardonable sins. I would argue because when you were here last you're like I need a shot. When like the male feminist is sitting right here, you're like, "I need a shot, Brian." So, like, no, you do need alcohol to cope. You need alcohol to cope. That's a form of

Erica Perrygluttony. That's overindulging. So, but it's okay. I I'm a degenerate, too. So, we're both in the same league. We're besties. We're kindred spirits. We're like the same.

Andrew WilsonYou're wrong. So, if I if I do you do you know what people used to say in the 17 1800s? No, I wasn't around at that time. What What did they say? Did you know? Were you there? I mean I mean you know that there's books from those

Andrew Wilsontimes, right? I'm sure you've never read Yeah, but things have been things have been written and rewritten all throughout history. Yeah, I know. But do you think that if it's just one person who writes the book and nobody ever rewrote the book? No [ __ ] It was not

Andrew Wilsonone person. Like what? It wasn't just Do you know them? Wait, can you Okay, so what was your point? I'd love to hear it. Yes. My point is is that sometimes people would drink alcohol to do what they called fortifying themselves. So could be for any number of different

Andrew Wilsonreasons. Sometimes it was especially helpful if you were working outside. It would take the tension off if you had a quick drink or if you hadn't seen a friend for a long time, you'd have a nip with your friend. Things like this in

Andrew Wilsonorder to relieve tension or one way that men often greet each other um is to say, "Hey, man, you want to go have a beer?" Do you think that Do you think that the church would consider it sinful to go have a beer with your friend? So, what

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