Rachel Wilson vs. Feminist Conservative Driena Sixto Debate | Whatever Debates 26
Date: 2026-03-29
Duration: 6h 07m
Brian AtlasIdentified Speakers
SPEAKER_01Driena Sixto(guest)
SPEAKER_03Rachel Wilson(guest)
SPEAKER_05Brian Atlas(host)
Key Moments
00:00:16
IntroBrian introduces debate: Rachel Wilson vs Driena Sixto
00:25:17
Key MomentRachel: if women didn't vote, there would never be another Democrat president
01:43:03
Key MomentRachel demolishes economic argument for low birth rates: poorest people have most children
02:25:30
QuoteDriena's closing: suggests Rachel take one-way trip to Iran if she doesn't like women's rights
05:38:09
QuoteRachel's closing: Driena came unarmed to a debate. If it was a beauty pageant she'd do great.
Topics Discussed
00:25:17
Women's Suffrage and 19th Amendment
Central debate. Rachel argues women shouldn't vote. Driena argues voting is inherent right.
00:45:23
Prenuptial Agreements
Extended debate between Rachel and Driena on prenups and financial independence in marriage.
01:02:10
Pornography: Ban or Free Speech?
Rachel advocates criminalizing porn. Driena opposes banning despite agreeing its harmful.
01:38:32
Birth Rate Collapse
Rachel argues women's access to education is #1 correlate to declining birth rates.
02:42:09
Force and Patriarchy
Rachel argues rights only exist because men with force grant them.
Transcript
Page 4 of 7
02:54:42
Rachel Wilsonyou've worked before >> under my husband. For my husband's company. >> Okay. But you do work >> for my husband. >> Yes. But you are financially indep independent. >> I do not. I don't have any bank accounts that are in my name only. Everything is
02:54:54
Rachel Wilsonjoint. I don't have any assets that are in my name only. Everything is joint. Mhm. So, >> so if you wanted if you wouldn't be able to get out of that relationship or >> Sure. I would
02:55:06
Rachel Wilson>> I would be I if he if he decided to be a serial cheater and I and we went to our priest. >> How about just one time? Would you would you >> It would depend. >> I don't >> That's not We have different values on that thing.
02:55:18
Rachel Wilson>> Maybe. But I'm not going to break up a family unless I can tell you there's no hope. >> Broke up the family. That's what a childless woman would say because I put what my children need above me and my
02:55:31
Rachel Wilsonhurt feelings and it would depend. I'm not saying it's okay. I'm not saying it's moral, but if it's So, let's take this really common scenario just as an example. >> A lot of women will get married, have one or two kids with a guy, and stop sleeping with him.
02:55:45
Rachel Wilson>> Okay? >> And it'll have been, you know, the poor guy's gone five years and he hasn't been touched. He's tried to talk to her about it. He's tried to reason with her about it. He's tried to go out of his way. He's tried to be romantic. He's try he's tried to do everything he knows how to
02:55:57
Rachel Wilsondo to fix it. And she goes, "Look, I'm just not into it anymore. Ever since I had the baby, it's just not my thing. I just don't want it." >> Okay. >> If he cheats in that situation, do I think that she should automatically divorce the guy? No, I don't.
02:56:10
Rachel Wilson>> Okay. >> That might seem crazy to you, but you keep the family together. >> I still think cheating is a choice. Um, >> of course, and I'm not saying it's all right. pretty much >> usually it can, but there's a lot of
02:56:23
Driena Sixtodead bedrooms out there. >> Or or you can as a man >> if that's the situation you're in. I think >> as a man, can't you just get a divorce yourself if your woman is not fulfilling? >> Yes. But this is what duties
02:56:35
Rachel Wilson>> your whole view comes from. And I'm I don't mean this as an insult. I'm saying you don't know what you don't know because you don't have children. And when you have children, they come first. Yes. Way before your feelings, your um
02:56:48
Driena Sixto>> And I would want to give no matter how badly >> a good example, especially if I have a daughter, I would want to not show her that somebody can disrespect me and can
02:56:58
Driena Sixtotreat the family badly and I still stay for the sake of not breaking up a marriage. I wouldn't want to set that. >> It depends. It depends. So, if your daughter found out, if your daughter found out you were terrible to your
02:57:10
Rachel Wilsonhusband, you don't sleep with him, you belittle him in front of people, you're a jerk to him, and then he cheats >> because he doesn't want to remove the kid's mom from the home, but he doesn't know what else to do of it's not
02:57:23
Rachel Wilsoncorrect. It's not a moral choice that he made, but I think that's very different from you're being the best wife you can be, you're being a good, faithful woman, and the guy just wants to screw other people. Totally different situation. So
02:57:35
Driena Sixtothat's why I say it depends. >> Yeah. Uh I personally do believe that, you know, cheating is a oneanddone thing. And uh >> again, that's easy to say when you don't have kids.
02:57:46
Driena Sixto>> I know. Um but I also know that I have consistent moral values. Uh I also know in the Bible, you know, Jesus particularly references as adultery for one of the reasons that breaking up a
02:57:58
Rachel Wilsonmarriage would be okay. It's that big of an infraction. >> It can be. It can be. It's that big of an infraction. Granted that it can be, but I don't think >> that, you know, marriage is a long time.
02:58:10
Rachel WilsonEspecially if you get married young. Say you get married at 22, you live to be till you're 82. That's 60 years. A lot of shit's going to happen in 60 years. You're going to hurt each other. You're going to do wrong to each other. You're going to screw up and
02:58:23
Rachel Wilson>> still keep it in your same women, by the way. >> I I agree. But I'm just saying I don't think it's an always every time must get divorced just because somebody had some infidelity. I think there are situ and
02:58:36
Rachel Wilsonthere's tons of couples out there watching this right now who will say, "Yep, we screwed up. He cheated. I cheated. We worked it out. We stayed together. We're better than ever. We're happy and our family's still intact and our kids are happy." So, there are
02:58:48
Rachel Wilsonsituations where that is the more moral and less selfish decision. >> Sure. And I'm all for choice. We do have some chats that we have to get to. Uh we have base Justin here. >> You shared plenty last show. If I
02:59:01
Brian Atlasremember correctly, your boyfriend clears 1 million a year as CEO of a nonprofit. Correct. How much more time are you going to take? Point is difficult to recognize how a priority
02:59:11
Driena Sixtodot dot dot. >> Um yeah, that's very very uh vague because uh being the CEO of a nonprofit doesn't mean that he makes a million dollars a year through the nonprofit.
02:59:23
Driena Sixtothere's other business ventures included in that which is like assets and property and whatnot. But um you know I do think that >> uh again it takes time in getting to
02:59:35
Driena Sixtoknow the person that you're going to spend the rest of your life with, right? Um so again for me it's not about money.
02:59:44
Driena SixtoUh it's about making sure that what we like is similar. You want to ideally uh match up and marry somebody that you enjoy. >> I apologize for those things.
02:59:56
Brian Atlas>> I do have to move it on, but uh we have AEI. Uh thank you for the super chat. Rachel loves cooking so much. She cooked you, didn't she? Who brought the barbecue? It's pretty good. Thanks. Thank you for your super chat there.
03:00:08
Brian AtlasAppreciate it. Uh a lot of barbecue references today. Mossing with you. >> We love a good barbecue. Here is $100 to mute Blonde Obama's mic and let Rachel read her favorite part from her book.
03:00:21
Brian AtlasWell, unfortunately during the debates we don't allow microphone mutes, but thank you very much for your uh super chat there. And if you do want to
03:00:30
Brian Atlas>> uh pick up Rachel's book, Oult Feminism, she brought a Do you want a signed copy of Rachel's book? >> Oh, she'll sign something tells me no. >> No, not no go. the her book called
03:00:43
Driena SixtoEverybody I Don't Like Is a Feminist. No, thank you. >> That's not Maybe that's part The book is The >> I was actually considering making like a fun little prop and and putting that little uh uh cover on your book. It's
03:00:56
Driena Sixtolike Rachel on top of a rainbow. Everybody I don't like is a feminist, which is basically your argument. You know, everybody that disagrees >> with you that believes in >> Let me uh let me get through some of the
03:01:08
Brian Atlassuper chats here. We have We have Red Fox. Thank you for your super chat, Red Fox. Briana, I'm not sure who that is. If duties for women are to behave, excuse me, if duties for women are to have babies, support the family, and
03:01:20
Driena Sixtomake a home, are you failing your duty? Are you a good example for women? >> Uh, good, great question. Um, are women not having kids at the age of 50 or 60
03:01:31
Driena Sixtoor 70 failing as women? I think that everybody does that on their own timeline. Um, whenever is best for them. Wait, you mean like women who had kids earlier, but now they're 60 and they're not still having them?
03:01:43
Driena Sixto>> Yeah. As in if the duty of a woman is to have children, uh, at what point does it stop? >> What if you're like me and you have them supposed to have you just have them until like menopause and then you just can't? You know,
03:01:55
Rachel Wilson>> you did your duty. >> Sure. That's that's what I'm saying. That's what the super chatter is saying. >> The super chat is just saying he's not saying you got to always perpetually be having kids. He's just saying at some point in your fertile years you should be doing that and that doesn't last
03:02:10
Rachel Wilsonforever. >> It's so crazy how people are so concerned with somebody else's, you know. >> Well, we're very concerned about the birth rate. Yeah. And the fact that women are generally focused on career and not focused on family anymore. It's a serious problem.
03:02:22
Driena Sixto>> Yes. That I am actually trying to address myself and I'm not doing that by telling the women that, hey, you know, you should not vote. That's not going to make them have more kids. telling them
03:02:34
Driena Sixtothat they can't vote and that they shouldn't be financially independent is not going to I think is not great foreplay to >> but you're acting like I come on here and I go listen ladies you shouldn't be
03:02:45
Rachel Wilsonvoting and you need to depend on a man forever no like what I'm saying is what my message to women is >> don't listen to her don't listen to
03:02:56
Rachel WilsonTaylor Swift or Beyonce or Kla Harris or Hillary Clinton >> or any of these women who who put their career first, who think who think they have to be independent and prove they
03:03:09
Rachel Wilsoncan do it on their own. There is no shame and you are not a loser. If you marry a wonderful guy, you have kids with him and yes, he's the one that makes all the money and you stay home and you depend on him. That does not
03:03:21
Rachel Wilsonmake you weak. That does not make you a loser and you don't have to feel ashamed about that and you shouldn't feel bad about it for one minute. It doesn't make you ignorant and you're not going to get beaten and abused. >> I agree. Um, but don't listen to these
03:03:33
Driena Sixtowomen. Why What do you have against women that do decide to put their career first and then have kids? >> I don't have anything against them, but I asked them I asked I didn't say they're losers. I think >> everything that you said.
03:03:46
Rachel Wilson>> I asked them this question. >> The women that have kids. >> And I'll ask you the question. >> Sure. >> What duty are you serving to anyone or anything outside yourself?
03:03:57
Rachel Wilson>> Be more specific with your question. >> I can't be. Are you serving? Are you performing any duty to anyone or anything outside yourself? Or is your life only about you and what you want
03:04:09
Driena Sixtoand serving yourself? >> What what duty h I wanted to ask you. What duty do you feel I have to anybody outside of myself? Um but that would
03:04:19
Driena Sixtojust let you talk even more. Um but uh I do think that nobody has a duty to anybody but but themselves from a legal perspective or from anything.
03:04:32
Driena Sixto>> I see. So >> um we do we do Let me finish answering your question. Um yeah, I think we all have individual uh choices on the timeline that we pick out for our life
03:04:43
Driena Sixtoand that I think everybody lives their life as a rational individual that does what is most beneficial to them or what they think is most beneficial to them at
03:04:52
Driena Sixtothe moment and we don't have a duty to uh basically make anybody happy outside of ourselves. So, I'm sure a bunch of the people watching make anyone happy.
03:05:04
Driena Sixto>> People watching, you know, would love to be like, "Oh, you know, she should have kids like right now and, you know, get off the mic or whatever." Get to it. Um, I don't care. And nobody should care. >> I'm not saying you have to have kids
03:05:15
Rachel Wilsontomorrow. I'm not going to I'm not going to go personal about you because it's not my business and I don't care. And I don't think that it even is >> pertinent to what we're talking about. What we're talking about is what's best
03:05:26
Rachel Wilsonfor society, right? And what I'm saying is men don't get to have this beautiful idea that I don't have a duty to anyone outside myself because if men didn't do
03:05:37
Rachel Wilsonwhat men do, we all die. So let me get let me give you a scenario. >> Mhm. >> If tomorrow you woke up and it was some weird rapture and all of the men
03:05:49
Rachel Wilsondisappeared and it was only women left on the planet. Okay, that's scenario number one. Scenario number two is we wake up tomorrow and all of the women are gone and it's only men left on the
03:06:01
Driena Sixtoplanet. Who lives longer? Uh the women. And will you let me explain why? So let's say that the women disappeared men the species would die off because only
03:06:13
Driena Sixtomen can sorry only women can have kids. So that's it. We are done. >> So they live until they're like 70 and then it's over. >> We are done as >> So the men make it how long? like >> I I natural >> lipan. I'm not talking about that. Yeah.
03:06:25
Driena SixtoWhatever. Who >> all the men live until they're like 80, 90, and then they die. >> So yeah, whoever. Correct. However, if and I'm not saying I'm supporting either scenario obviously, right?
03:06:36
Driena Sixto>> But if men did disappear tomorrow, just by um statistically, there's a lot of women in the population that would still be pregnant. Um, and
03:06:49
Rachel Wilsonthen they would have kids and would repopulate the earth and civilization would continue to >> But what if all the male fetuses that the women were pregnant with disappeared also? >> Okay. Sure. >> So, only babies that can be born as girls. >> Fetuses fetus is gone. And I love that
03:07:02
Driena Sixtoyou asked this because I thought about this question before because I know you guys have talked about the scenario. >> Uh, women are fertile, right, for 5 days
03:07:12
Driena Sixtobefore ovulation. So, let's say a woman had relations with men 5 days prior to their ovulation day and still have the swimmers in her body, not babies, not a
03:07:23
Driena Sixtofetus. >> She would become pregnant and then yes, uh she would have a child and so statistically speaking, >> but all the the boys can't be born though. There's a weird noxious gas in
03:07:35
Driena Sixtothe air that only kills men. I'm just saying now you have to be more women surviving without men is the the hypothetical. That's that's that's the hypothetical you gave me. The species would actually survive if men
03:07:47
Driena Sixtodisappeared. >> You're avoiding the percentage of the population. >> You're doing what I said you would do in my opening and you're giving I'm giving you exactly why uh that would work
03:07:57
Driena Sixtobecause right now as we speak a lot a percentage of the population worldwide is pregnant right now. Some of them are not. >> Wait wait wait. It doesn't look I'm
03:08:07
Brian Atlasjumping on avoiding she's avoiding some of your loophole is going to waste a bunch of time. >> It's not a loophole. It's >> a loophole because what Rachel is trying to get at here is not in in in the
03:08:19
Brian Atlasinstance where there are women who Yes, there would be women who are actively pregnant. And so conceivably if those women were able to make it to term and
03:08:29
Brian Atlasgive birth to the child, then that child starts at zero. And then the species arguable even if it was only female babies arguably the lifespan of that child would extend beyond that. But
03:08:40
Brian Atlasperhaps Rachel what if you were to refine your question to uh you know what just either all the pregnancies end in that moment too or pregnant women also die I guess. So it's
03:08:52
Driena Sixto>> or only the female embryos can survive and be born. It doesn't matter. A world of all women everybody dies >> versus a world of all men. Um, I think
03:09:03
Driena Sixtoeverybody dies. I think it just depends on how long it is before either one does. And both scenarios are terrible. >> Women, let let me help you and tell you what would really happen. The women
03:09:14
Rachel Wilsonwould survive very short period of time because they cannot run the critical infrastructure. >> It's like a psychic or something. >> No, let me explain it. >> Water treatment plants run by men. Power
03:09:26
Rachel Wilsonplants run by men. The grid goes down. There's no hospitals. There's no more ways to manufacture uh antibiotics. There's no heart surgeons. Like even the
03:09:37
Rachel Wilsonfemales who can do that stuff, who can do surgery, who can do first aid, they can't do any of that without this world. Honey, this is the reason why feminism didn't become a thing until the last
03:09:48
Rachel Wilsonhundred years because technology made and maintained by men is the only thing that allows you to believe you don't need men. Do you get that? >> Wait, wait. You're trying to put You're trying to put words in my mouth. Who is saying that we don't need men? Have I
03:10:02
Rachel Wilsonever said that? >> You were just trying to evade the hypothetical and act like, well, everyone's just going to die. I don't know. >> Yeah. Everybody would just die. Society would die. >> But the men could survive way longer obviously than the women because the women cannot.
03:10:15
Rachel Wilson>> Okay. What is your point to this? >> My point is that my point is that your belief in women's rights, >> you have to ask the men to guarantee
03:10:24
Rachel Wilsonyour rights. your any rights you have are granted, guaranteed and enforced by men only. Fantastic. >> And the minute they don't want to do that anymore, you don't have them. So if
03:10:37
Rachel Wilsonyou want to live in reality, >> make it right. Does it make it right? That is my argument. >> That's an is statement. That's not an statement. Now >> just answer the question. Does it make it right? >> I don't agree to the same paradigm as
03:10:49
Rachel Wilsonyou. I don't believe in rights like human rights. Everybody has rights. I have rights. You have rights. I believe in duties. We have duties to each other. We have duties to society. We have duties to God. >> Correct. >> We have duties but not rights.
03:11:03
Rachel Wilson>> Correct. >> As individuals, that's what you believe. >> Yes. >> Okay. I disagree. I believe we have. >> What you believe in is is fairy tale stuff. It's it's only there, but it's
03:11:14
Rachel Wilsononly there granted to you by men. Do you understand that? >> I understand that, Rachel. Do you? Well, then you'd better be nice to them and you'd better stop arguing that you don't need them and we should have our own money and you should have your own money
03:11:26
Driena Sixtoand we're all going to just live as individual words in my mouth. >> This rugged individuality that you believe in doesn't exist. >> I've never once argued that we don't need men and that we shouldn't value men or anything like that. Rachel, again,
03:11:39
Driena Sixtostop trying to put words in my mouth. You know exactly what you're doing. Um my only argument has been that regardless of whether uh it is because
03:11:48
Driena Sixtoof you know the generosity of men that we do have rights, it doesn't >> negate the fact that it's still basically what should be the case. That should be
03:12:01
Driena Sixto>> according to you >> because you prefer it >> that women and men have equal value under the law. >> Why does that mean women need political power? Because >> having equal value doesn't mean we
03:12:12
Driena Sixtoshould have power >> because we all live under the system, right? We all have a voice on the system that we want to live. >> Bird hands. >> I'm Hispanic. I talk with my hands. So, um
03:12:25
Driena Sixto>> I have a collab coming out with Homath really soon, too, by the way. >> But again, our rights don't come from whether people or not can um can overpower us. I mean, they do.
03:12:37
Driena Sixto>> They actually literally do. >> Okay, Rachel. perfect example for you. See if you can understand it. Okay. >> Um, >> I'll try I'll try my best. >> Black people in this country are a
03:12:47
Driena Sixtominority. 13% of the population. Many years ago, it was an even smaller percentage of the population. >> Uh, white men basically granted black
03:12:58
Driena Sixtopeople the right to vote, right? Because they are such a minority that they could decide that that's not the case. But do you believe that black people inherently
03:13:10
Driena Sixtohave a right to vote because of their worth as individuals? That's the argument I'm making. Rachel, >> wait a minute. Um, >> that that's basically >> who granted black people rights? >> White. Well, men who >> men and women
03:13:24
Rachel Wilson>> and women. >> No, women didn't grant black people rights. >> Whatever. I'm saying the white population. >> No, no, this is key. This is the whole part you're missing. This is the part you keep skipping. Who granted black people rights? >> Fantastic. I'm talking about >> who granted the black people rights.
03:13:37
Driena Sixto>> Rachel, the majority of >> She's just going to avoid she's just going to avoid her question. Maybe the question the majority basically a person's rights inherent rights are not
03:13:48
Rachel Wilsondetermined by whether or not >> uh a majority grants it to you. >> I agree. It's not about majorities. That's not what it's about. So, let's say there was a population the population shifted over time. It's now
03:14:00
Rachel Wilson60% women, 40% men. >> Mhm. men still grant the rights because they have a monopoly on force even if they're 60% women. So who granted the black who granted black people rights?
03:14:12
Driena Sixto>> Does it make it morally okay is what I'm saying. Just because Okay, let me give you another example. >> Okay, I can't wait >> another example. >> You're just going to I'm just going to still come right back to who granted
03:14:25
Driena Sixtothem rights? Who? >> It's not about who grants the rights. >> It's totally about who grants the right. That's all it's about. about whether they should be whether that is a right
03:14:35
Driena Sixtothey inherently have or not right so for example in Iran women don't have rights because the system that exists there doesn't give it to them
03:14:46
Driena Sixto>> are they equal in worth and value and should they have equal voting rights as the men do in their country yes that is that is my argument to you that is my argument >> yeah and we're gonna just keep going
03:14:59
Driena Sixtoback and forth and differing on And I think it's just a matter of again hypocrisy. Do you practice trade? >> Who granted the rights? >> You still vote and you still because my husband tells me to vote and I submit to
03:15:12
Rachel Wilsonmy husband. So who granted >> That's a great excuse. That is a fantastic excuse, Rachel. >> Yes, you're right. Black people didn't have rights. And then who granted them rights? >> White people. White population in this country.
03:15:25
Rachel Wilson>> No. Nope. White. You got it right the first time. Men. >> Fantastic. cuz they were cuz they were the larger uh population. >> No, because they have the monopoly on force. It had nothing to do with them being >> That's exactly what I'm saying, Rachel.
03:15:36
Rachel WilsonThey had the monopoly on force. >> But it's always men. So like could white women outnumbered black people, right? Back then, prior to civil rights, there was more white women than there were black. >> Black people have a right to vote
03:15:48
Driena Sixtobecause the white man says so or because they are equal as an individual. >> Are you talking about should or are you talking about do? >> Should I? Because I should. be 20 lb lighter, but I'm not. So,
03:16:01
Rachel Wilson>> should >> I should be, but I'm not. >> Yes. Should. >> Right. So, actually, that's that's the argument I'm making. >> If you want to talk about uh claims, then we have to get into epistemology. And you're not going to do any better
03:16:14
Rachel Wilsonwith that. That's going to be harder for you than this has been. >> Rachel, this has been the argument I've been making from the beginning of the show. >> Okay. Tell me why would they should tell
03:16:24
Driena Sixtome why people should have rights. because we have inherent value and worth regardless according to regardless of gender or race or demographic. >> You disagree with that.
03:16:36
Rachel Wilson>> I didn't say I disagree with it. I'm saying I don't think you say we should. >> I'm saying >> I don't care about what we should. I'm saying I I'm the one now saying I live
03:16:48
Rachel Wilsonin reality where things are actually how they are. And in reality, >> men grant rights and take away rights at will. And I don't think it's the correct way to look at history or the correct
03:17:00
Rachel Wilsonway to look at society to say everyone has a say. Everybody has these rights. Especially when you've detached them from duties because you still haven't told me a duty women have to men. Men
03:17:11
Driena Sixtohave duties to women. Right. >> Which ones? Name them. >> Which duties do men have to women? >> To women specifically. Not to the country or anything like that. What duty does Brian have to any specific woman
03:17:24
Brian Atlasout there? Well, not I'm not talking about individuals. >> No, I am talking about a different thing really quick. Can we define the terms here? Can we define >> uh duty and can we define rights?
03:17:36
Rachel Wilson>> Well, rights are just an entitlement absent duty. It's something that you just deserve. And women love to talk about what they deserve. The deserving I deserve, right? >> Women Women think of the world this way.
03:17:48
Rachel WilsonThis is a gender difference. Women think of the world as but it should be and I deserve and men think of the world as but it is and nobody's coming to rescue me. Okay, that's a an inherent difference.
03:18:00
Driena Sixto>> Fantastic. Get to the second point. Define what is a duty that people have to one another. What is a duty that I have? >> A duty is a what duty do I have? >> A duty is a moral obligation to God.
03:18:13
Rachel Wilson>> Okay. Me Oh, to God. Okay. So, we're getting religious. >> And via being to God. duty would you assign me to any man that exists out there right now? >> Uh, you don't have an individual duty to an individual man because you're not
03:18:25
Rachel Wilsonmarried. But as a woman, you have a duty to society to do one of a couple of things. Either society >> either produce the next generation or support and help those who are producing
03:18:37
Rachel Wilsonthe next generation in whatever capacity you can. If you can't do that, that's what women's duties to society are. Because if we don't do that, society dies. Gotcha. everything collapses. Men have a duty to provide protection,
03:18:50
Rachel Wilsoninfrastructure, all the things I've already talked about. Because if they don't do that, we all die. Everything crumbles. That's what a duty is. It's something we're obligated to do outside of ourselves because if we don't, cast
03:19:03
Driena Sixtocatastrophe ensues. >> Fantastic. I know that uh we have duties as a society for it to uh function. However, how are you going to enforce these duties on individuals, right,
03:19:15
Driena Sixtowithout basically trampling on their individual rights and their free will? And what they decide they can uh contribute to society because for
03:19:26
Driena Sixtoexample, yes, you have men that are carpenters and that is how they contribute to society. They're electricians. There are men that have nothing to do with that. They're freaks
03:19:36
Driena Sixtoin the sheets and they're, you know, uh, finance nerds. Uh, how would you say that they fulfill all of these other duties of protecting women and
03:19:45
Driena Sixtoprotecting society? My argument is that we all have that we're all individuals, right? And we all choose how it is that we contribute to society based on our
03:19:57
Driena Sixtoindividual strengths, what we're actually good at. And that is the most moral way of living. and that that is what leads to the best societal outcomes
03:20:08
Driena Sixtobecause we're not stifling uh human ingenuity or sticking them into boxes and telling them women you have to do this because imagine if women were all just mothers forever throughout history.
03:20:21
Rachel WilsonI mean, like I said before, we wouldn't have refrigeration. We wouldn't have kept we wouldn't have we wouldn't have true. All of those things, I'm I'm guaranteeing you you can look them up right now. Somebody send some super
03:20:33
Rachel Wilsonchats debunking her nonsense that women invented refrigeration. It's going to be something >> refrigeration systems. >> Yeah, it's always something like this. Oh, men actually invented refrigerators, but a woman invented this one specific
03:20:45
Brian Atlaspart that like kind of made it better, but her boyfriend actually helped her. No, Florence uh parart if anybody wants to uh >> wait might I ask a clarifying question
03:20:55
Brian Atlasis your position that um so so you're saying that women invented these specific inventions >> things uh in her case technology for refrigerators not the refrigerator so
03:21:07
Driena Sixtorefrigeration system >> these these things could not have spontaneously been invented by men absent women >> yeah they absolutely could I'm saying this is reality this is what happened
03:21:18
Rachel Wilsonand imagine if We told women that no, you can't do this. You can't. >> Oh, yeah. Imagine what would have happened if we wouldn't have let Florence who ever invent some kind of thing that went in a refrigerator that a man would probably invent a better thing
03:21:31
Driena Sixtoanyway. >> Yeah. You're you're basically stifling human creativity. >> How dare I stifle Listen >> and and actual uh uses to society again. >> You know what the fundamental difference
03:21:44
Rachel Wilsonis here? >> Not everybody. fundamental difference is that I don't really >> not everybody wants to be a mother. I would make that here's the thing. >> You care about each and the reason is
03:21:56
Rachel Wilsonbecause you care about you. Okay? You care about individuals and what the individual wants and what the individual makes them happy because you want to pursue what you like and what you prefer and what makes you happy. It comes from a place of selfishness that you want to
03:22:09
Driena Sixtodefend. >> It's more selfish for me to do what I want than it is to prescribe other people what they should be doing. Because here's what here's what motivates me. Here's what motivates me. The reason I'm here,
03:22:20
Rachel Wilson>> I don't give a what adult people want. Adult women, I don't care. I care about what femin I care about what feminism has done to children.
03:22:31
Rachel Wilson>> That's my primary beef with it. And if you go into the last chapter of my book, I go over all of the hell that we have unleashed on children who pay the primary price for us telling women, "You don't have you don't have to do anything, sweetie. You just do whatever
03:22:44
Rachel Wilsonyou want with your life and whatever makes you happy. And we're going to arrange all of human society around women and what makes them happy and how they feel. The people that pay the price for that is primarily children and
03:22:56
Rachel Wilsonsecondarily everyone else. I don't care what you want to do for a career or what makes you happy. You >> I know you don't. And I don't care what you want to do with yours either.
03:23:06
Rachel Wilson>> You should care about the future of the human race. You should be producing the next generation and you should be living your life in a way that is best for them, not for you. That's what I believe.
03:23:17
Driena Sixto>> I do that however I see fit that that do that. You don't do that at all. >> You know how I am doing that? By making sure that I have the right conditions to
03:23:27
Driena Sixtohave children so that I don't uh give them a family that's going to be broken up in the future. I know you have experience with that. I'm trying to avoid talking about you cuz I don't I
03:23:40
Driena Sixtodon't want to make this about you and your whether you're having children because listen >> it is about the individual at the end of the day and yes we do benefit as a
03:23:50
Driena Sixtosociety if people fill different roles that need to be filled but again you are trying to put individuals into boxes based on gender roles and gender roles do exist and there's certain things that women are naturally good at. It's like
03:24:04
Rachel Wilsonso over your head. It's like you're just going to be cute for some reason. >> For example, uh some women are just >> if you die tomorrow, they're just going to fill your job. Some other blonde chick who looks good in a ball gown is
03:24:16
Rachel Wilsongoing to go to the political dinner and take pictures. Okay. You're not doing anything that's going to that's going to leave a legacy after you're gone. You're not having an impact on society in that way. >> Do you think every woman should be a
03:24:29
Rachel Wilsonmother? >> Yes. I disagree. >> There's a there's a few depends on the person's character. Some women are just not mother. There's a few outliers. There's a Listen, we can't talk about things on an individual level because
03:24:42
Rachel Wilsonthere's always outliers. No, we can't because you're the type of woman who goes, >> "Well, I I would say men on average are taller than women." You go, "Well, I'm taller than my friend Bob. He's 5'4 and I'm 5'6." That's what you do endlessly
03:24:55
Rachel Wilsonthrough this whole debate. You go, "But what about this outlier? What about this person?" It's like, are there a small subset of women who are not cut out for motherhood? >> You've gone from You've gone from denying.
03:25:05
Rachel Wilson>> Are you going to just yap the whole time and just talk about my individual rights and I think we should all ride unicorns down rainbows because I think that would be best. And
03:25:16
Driena Sixto>> they would they would labize you for hysteria just a few years back, Rachel. >> Um, but >> I don't think so. I don't think it would be me who would be having the trouble. And now you Rachel, now we've gone from
03:25:28
Driena SixtoI don't think women should vote, even though I do and I will. I don't believe women should not hypocritical. And now we already established that's not hypocritical. >> On top, cherry on top. Women should
03:25:39
Rachel Wilsonprimarily be mothers because I say so. >> No, because it's their duty. It's not. >> Do you want to know why? Are you going to let me tell you why? >> Let me finish. I'm just going to endlessly yap about nothing. you've just
03:25:51
Driena Sixtobeen repeating your same five talking points for 4 hours >> and and you've been doing exactly exactly the same thing. Um, but >> here make a make a quick point, but I do need to get
03:26:03
Driena Sixto>> things moving. The whole point is that now you're trying to prescribe to women as a gender what they should be doing. >> Hold on. Wait, Rachel, do let her finish her point. >> And uh, and I disagree with that. I
03:26:15
Driena Sixtothink women can be multifaceted, multi-talented. They could be uh wives and mothers and at the same time also contribute in other meaningful ways to
03:26:25
Driena Sixtosociety. Uh that is reality the same way men do it. Because imagine if I said you know men's we're going to divide men and women's roles from like what it used to be back in the stone ages or whatever.
03:26:37
Driena SixtoWomen stayed home, cooked, cleaned, took care of the kids and the men went and you know hunted woolly mammoths and whatnot. Uh, and right now, you know, the job that all men should be doing is
03:26:47
Driena Sixtogoing out and hunting woodly mammoths instead of using their creativity to to, I don't know, do different things that make modern life better. Again, you're trying to box people into certain things
03:26:59
Driena Sixtojust based on what you believe in. And I disagree with that. Fundamentally, I am an individualist. And I think the more we allow people to be individuals, the more that they gift to society and helps
03:27:11
Brian Atlasus all advance, live better, have better relations between the sexes. >> Let's do this. There will be a little bit later on there will be closing statements so you guys can each lay out
03:27:21
Rachel Wilsonyour final closing statements. But >> uh we do have one thing. Can I say one thing before we go to chats? I'll make it brief. No, I'm I'm not an individualist. And
03:27:34
Rachel Wilsonthe reason that I say women have a duty to have the next generation is cuz only we can. Men can't step in and have the babies. The reason we don't tell men,
03:27:46
Rachel Wilson"Hey guys, we understand you don't want to do the dirty, dangerous, difficult jobs that could kill you. So, you know, it's all about what you want, men. You know, just stay home and play World of
03:27:57
Rachel WilsonWarcraft." Sorry, Brian. um just just you know do whatever you want and follow your dreams. We do not say that to men. If if men >> What do you what what do you mean? >> If men don't step in,
03:28:09
Rachel Wilson>> we tell men to follow. If you're walking down the street with your boyfriend and a guy tries to mug you and he runs away, we as a society go, "You coward, you piece of shit." You
03:28:20
Rachel Wilsonknow, we we shame the hell out of that guy and we go, "You had a duty to protect her." If if uh the politicians who are mainly men, if the president who's a man does not defend our country
03:28:31
Rachel Wilsonfrom foreign invaders, we say, "He sucks at his job. We fire him. We want someone else." We don't let men do what makes them feel good. We don't let men decide what they find fulfilling and follow
03:28:43
Rachel Wilsontheir dreams. We only say that to women. We only say that to women. And we go, "Sweetie, you don't have to have a baby if you don't want to. You don't have to be a baby factory." And it's like, okay, if you're not going to and all the other
03:28:55
Rachel WilsonTaylor Swifts and and all these girls are not going to you what? You think I'm going to do it by myself? You guys think that it's fine to go off and I'm going to have a glamorous career where I close
03:29:07
Rachel Wilsonthe deal over brunch and some other lady out there can have all the babies? No. >> Why can't you do both, Rachel? That's >> Well, that's been my point. My point is I did that first for 25 years before
03:29:19
Rachel Wilsondoing this. And you're calling me a hypocrite for it. You're looking down on me for it. You're chastising me and calling me a hypocrite cuz you're like, "Well, you're out here promoting stuff. You You're out here making money. You're out here doing things. Why are you doing telling other women not to do what you did?"
03:29:32
Rachel Wilson>> No, I'm telling them to do what I did. Do what I did. Have all your kids first, raise them into adulthood. And then when they're big and grown, you know, I started at 20, which is what you're
03:29:43
Rachel Wilsonsupposed to do. You're supposed to start early in your 20s. And then by the time you're my age, 45, you're done having kids. Now you can, now you can go off and do other things because you've
03:29:54
Rachel Wilsonfulfilled your duty to society as a woman. We say the same thing to men. We go, men, you have to protect and you have to provide and you have to do the manly things. And if you don't, we'll
03:30:04
Driena Sixtoshame you into oblivion. >> Uh, okay. So you say that you you did your duty as a woman to society by having kids early,
03:30:15
Driena Sixto>> starting at your 20s. uh and then you know had five kids, right? >> Um what if Well, first of all, there's risks that come with that, right? >> There's risks for everything.
03:30:25
Driena Sixto>> I know, but let me finish let me finish my point. Uh you're prescribing women do this, but you're not telling them the negative things that happen from you doing that. >> Everyone else does. I don't have to cuz
03:30:38
Driena Sixtothe whole world fearongers women about what could go wrong >> personal or chastise you personally. Negative things of what? uh she had you know three marriages two no I didn't have three marriages
03:30:50
Driena Sixto>> or two or two failed relationships you know children from the first two relationship the negative things of what >> and the and the negative thing is >> she's saying something could go wrong if you depend on a man and have kids he could turn out to be a bad guy and
03:31:02
Driena SixtoRachel didn't that happen to you >> and then you have a family that is broken up and now you have to deal with a broken family with people outside of your current relationship and I think
03:31:14
Driena Sixtothat ultimately That is worse than women that wait a little bit longer in life, establish themselves, and then find somebody that um compatible. You're acting like those
03:31:26
Rachel Wilsonare mutually exclusive. And what happened to me? What happened to me was not because I was young or the guy I was with was young. What happened to me happened because those guys believed in
03:31:38
Rachel Wilsonthe you believe in. They were libertarians. They were like, "Oh, marriage is just a contract." Blah blah blah. picked and they wanted them. >> That's true. But out of because I was ignorant and I thought that was
03:31:50
Rachel Wilsoncorrect too. I thought like you when I was young and that's where I made the mistake. When I corrected the mistake was when I realized oh if I want a family which is all I ever wanted. I was
03:32:01
Rachel Wilsonnot interested in dating around until I'm 32. Like no thanks. I wanted to get married and have kids. I realized if I want that life, I've got to pick a guy like Andrew who is a strong leader, a
03:32:13
Rachel Wilsonpatriarch, a guy who's super responsible, a guy who is strong, a guy who takes care of me, not a guy who likes to split the bills. I used those split the bills. >> Rachel, you developed these ideas when?
03:32:25
Rachel WilsonAt what point in your life? >> About 24 25. Okay. >> About 25. >> So now I was still pretty I was still young enough to to let me but most women aren't.
03:32:35
Brian Atlas>> We do Hold on. We do have to get some chats uh coming in here. So, we have airborne animal. >> Thank you for your message, man. Love the live exposure of this undercover leftist
03:32:46
Brian Atlas>> feminist as a grifting self-centered opportunistic liar. Like all leftists, she immediately goes to race. Keep exposing them for who they are. Not one
03:32:57
Brian Atlasstep back from airborne animals. So, he's calling you a leftist feminist, blah blah, etc., etc. quick response to that if you'd like.
03:33:06
Driena Sixto>> Um, you know, again, you guys can put whatever titles you want on people that don't disagree with you. It does not make them true. Um, I think again facts
03:33:18
Brian Atlasliterally don't care about your feelings. Um, but getting uh again getting back to my point. >> Hold on. There's Sorry, more I there are more chats here, so let's get through the chats and then time permitting you guys can get back to it. I find it
03:33:31
Brian Atlashilarious you say you're a conservative when you do the very thing liberal feminists do when they get into an argument debate bird hands peek >> I'm Cuban
03:33:41
Brian Atlas>> convinced women are impossible to please at this point uh base Thor thank you very much for a message we have let's get through these uh red super chats here on the side we have Alan Roach
03:33:53
Brian Atlasthank for the Australian hundred n we are here to watch Rachel Cook now uh Drianna did I say it All right. >> Yep. For the first time. >> You you you are fluent in Spanish, correct?
03:34:06
Brian Atlas>> It's Is it your first language? >> Um I think it's toeto- toe with English. I was raised in Miami. >> Can you uh translate all these super chats into Spanish for for all the Spanish viewers of whatever? >> Yes, I could, but I'm not going to
03:34:19
Brian Atlasbecause that'd be a waste of time. But >> well, I mean, just to be considerate, like we're such a hater. >> We're very inclusive here. >> Hating on your super chats, guys. Yeah, we're very inclusive.
03:34:28
SPEAKER_02>> After this live, uh you can turn on u the auto. Yeah, the captions auto translate. Correct. Very >> see. She won't even accept her duty to translate for the Spanish speaking
03:34:40
Driena Sixtoaudience. Just she's an individual and she doesn't want to guys. You're out of luck. >> We're trying to like, you know, >> bring it. >> Any any languages you guys speak outside of English?
03:34:51
Brian AtlasI speak poor poor French >> sessa. Uh we have uh Jin Bob Smith. Thank you very much. If guns are the great equalizer, tell me why there are
03:35:03
Brian Atlaszero women in special forces, parah rescue, NARSAC, excuse me, Marsac, Delta Force, SEALs. The gun is a tool. Men and men alone are the great equalizer. >> Yeah. >> Uh I think
03:35:14
Driena Sixto>> men with guns cancel out women with guns. Sorry. >> Fantastic. That's true. That is true. But on one-on-one contact, that's >> Yeah, it's all we've got. It's the only thing we've got. So, I'm a I'm a big gun
03:35:26
Rachel Wilsonadvocate for women. I I needed one at a certain time in my life for sure. So, >> but as a but as groups, men with guns are always going to overtake women with guns, so it doesn't matter. >> We have Josh here. Thank you for your
03:35:37
Brian Atlassuper chat, Josh. The painful thing is the girl on the right doesn't understand the government allowed women to work to tax them. >> That's exactly right. She did say that, but she still wants us to do it for some
03:35:49
Driena Sixtoreason. >> And still doesn't know the Bible. This has been painful. >> Still doesn't know the Bible. That's That's funny. Um I started off my argument uh my opening statement with,
03:36:01
Driena Sixtoyou know, pointing the finger at the government for what we're seeing today and and taxing and putting women into the workforce to tax them. So that is incorrect. You should go back and watch the whole
03:36:13
Rachel Wilson>> But then why do you want them to do it? Why do you want to give the government more tax money? Why do you want Why do you want a smaller native population and more taxes going to the government? Who >> says that's the case? >> If you're advocating for women to work,
03:36:25
Driena Sixtothat's what you get. >> I'm not advocating for women to work. I'm advocating for everybody to have a choice. And I'm >> Everybody always did have a choice. >> I'm advocating for I'm advocating to
03:36:36
Driena Sixtomake it more attractive for women to uh want to be stay-at-home wise full-time. And I'm advocating for actual solutions creating the economy to permit that to
03:36:48
Driena Sixtobe the case. We haven't talked the only way to do that is to get mothers out of the workforce. How do you do that? >> We haven't talked about that yet in this show. Uh which is what are actual
03:36:57
Driena Sixtopractical solutions to the current problem that we're seeing nowadays. Um,
03:37:04
Driena Sixtoand my uh prescription for that is men should take uh self-control of their lives, of their bodies, of their health. >> Yeah, men don't give enough. That's the problem. The men don't give enough.
03:37:18
Driena Sixto>> That's not what I >> It's always more. That's not what I said, Rachel. >> Just always want more from the men. >> That's not what I said, Rachel. Uh, I want men to be happy and healthy, and right now they're not. They're depressed. I think a lot of that comes from uh
03:37:31
Driena Sixto>> them getting their asses handed to them in family court, >> having access to pornography, which has never been the case as we as we see. >> We should outlaw that >> and tell women they can't produce
03:37:42
Driena Sixtopornography >> and give it to them. That's your men. That's your prescription for it, Rachel. I think that >> it would work. Would it not work? >> It would work, Rachel, but it's one not going to happen. Two,
03:37:54
Rachel Wilson>> it is gonna two Rachel the onus. >> You realize pornography was illegal up until the 70s, right? It was always illegal. So why would it never happen? You think that just cuz things have been
03:38:05
Rachel Wilsonthis way for 40 or 50 years that they'll never go back. And that's insane. It's going to go back. It has to go back. >> Okay. Fantastic. Um if it doesn't, then
03:38:15
Driena Sixtothe onus is on the individual on whether they uh engage in these vices or not. Just like alcohol, right? Alcohol is available to everybody. Whether you engage in alcoholism is completely up to you and it is your choice.
03:38:28
Rachel Wilson>> That's different. Do you know how >> do you know how that's different? >> There can be good beneficial uses for consuming alcohol. For example, at church celebrations in the not what I'm talking about,
03:38:40
Rachel Wilson>> but I'm saying pornography there's never a good use for it. It's only bad. Therefore, you ban it. There's no such thing as like, oh, a good amount of pornography. >> I agree with you. >> Yeah. So you banned that
03:38:52
Driena Sixto>> Unfortunately, the reason why I wouldn't is because when somebody that disagrees with me comes to power, they will subject. >> You've said that a 100 times. >> They will subjectively >> You think heroin should be illegal?
03:39:03
Driena Sixto>> They would subjectively legalize heroin. >> Let me finish my my statement. >> Okay, I'm just going to drag you back to the question. >> They would subjectively decide what they think is evil or not. I know we're in
03:39:14
Driena Sixto>> You said this over and over now. Should heroin be illegal? Uh I think heroin is bad and yes it should be uh illegal but also but also >> but if we ban heroin somebody else might
03:39:26
Driena Sixtocome to power and then they might ban something else that we do want. >> It's exactly actually what has happened. Anything that we've made illegal there's been a black market for especially when it comes to the war on drugs.
03:39:38
Rachel Wilson>> Did you know that legalizing pornography increases human trafficking inflows into countries? So actually when you legalize pornography and sex work, you end up with more human trafficking as well. There is no good healthy amount of sex
03:39:51
Rachel Wilsonwork or pornography, there's no reason not to ban it. If you think we should ban narcotics, then you would have to be consistent and say we should also ban sex work and porn. >> Uh I agree, Rachel. >> Okay, good. >> Pornography. Yes.
03:40:03
Driena Sixto>> I want to see you out there telling all the Only Fans, girls, stop it. You're not allowed. We're getting rid of it. >> Yes, we're banning it. >> And I also agree, you know, with the whole war on drugs thing. I'm more of
03:40:13
Driena Sixtosomebody that believes that should be up to individuals. Um, natural selection, which is >> Oh, so you want to legalize drugs? >> Uh, I think that ultimately people are
03:40:25
Driena Sixtoalways going to find a way. >> Do you want to make all drugs legal? >> I think it's irrelevant because people >> I don't think it's irrelevant at all. We're looking for consistency within. It
03:40:37
Driena Sixtois irrelevant because if you think >> it has they have been illegal period for so many years and still people are dying of overdoses. >> Murder is illegal and some people still commit murder. Does that mean we
03:40:49
Driena Sixtoshouldn't have murder be illegal? Should we just legalize murder cuz well you can't stop all the murders so we might as well. Do you understand that you're like not thinking it through? >> No. One thing is you acting upon another
03:41:00
Driena Sixtoindividual. You consuming pornography or drugs only involves yourself. >> No, it doesn't. Do you see the distinction? >> Contradiction. Again, another point for
03:41:10
Rachel Wilsonme. She contradicts herself. Somebody else is just men. You just said men consuming pornography has a negative effect on the birth rate and women. It has a negative effect on relationships.
03:41:21
Rachel WilsonWomen don't want to marry these men. It's affecting all of us. So, the men need to stop doing pornography >> and primarily on themselves, >> which is what I'm trying to get at.
03:41:31
Rachel Wilson>> But they it also affects all of society. And it's the same thing. heroin. Yeah, some people are still going to do illegal drugs. However, when you legalize them, like Portugal and different places have, the problem gets
03:41:44
Rachel Wilsonexponentially worse. This whole idea, it's a libertarian idea once again, that oh, we just make everything legal and then, you know, the idiots will just go die from heroin and the rest of us will live in a utopia. No, that's not what
03:41:55
Rachel Wilsonyou find. What you find is that in places that you legalize these >> vices, there's certain vices that maybe it could be good for some people. Sometimes maybe it could be bad. So we
03:42:06
Rachel Wilsonpermit them as like a necessary evil. Maybe. Okay. That's different than there is no good reason to have certain things
03:42:16
Rachel Wilsonbe legal like murder, like hardcore drugs because heroin addicts don't just hurt themselves. That's a lie. They they decay and destroy the rest of society. They steal from people. They commit crimes.
03:42:28
Rachel Wilson>> You're you're preaching to the choir. Um >> then be consistent. I want to see consistency from you. You're like consistent. >> So, should we legalize heroin or not? >> I am consistent in telling you that if we ban pornography because I believe
03:42:42
Rachel Wilsonthat it's bad. >> That's not why we're banning it. We're not banning it because Rachel doesn't like it. We're banning it because it's detrimental to all of society. >> Yes. This is what conservatives believe.
03:42:52
Driena SixtoI agree. Liberals don't. And they will eventually come to power one day, right? We're we're not gonna have >> Oh, yeah. Keep letting women vote. >> Okay. >> That's how they get in every time. >> Whatever. It's going to happen, Rachel.
03:43:05
Driena SixtoAnd then again, my whole argument is it sets the precedent on making things illegal, banning things, etc. that you don't subjectively like. That is why the >> But that's not true. Also, >> Rachel, that's why the onus is the
03:43:17
Driena SixtoYou're also wrong about that. >> The onus is on the individual. I don't understand why you are arguing so much against the individual taking >> because I don't believe in that libertarian anymore. I grew up
03:43:28
Driena SixtoI grew up and became a full adult. I have responsibilities to other human beings besides myself. >> You're arguing against >> humans, men, women, whatever taking not taking responsibility for their own
03:43:41
Driena Sixtoactions. That's what you're >> still have to do that. >> That's what you're arguing against. >> If I can just have a minute to debunk this ridiculous claims that you just made. So you said if we >> he can't shut his laptop right now or
03:43:53
Rachel Wilsonphone and decide not to consume pornography. That's what you're arguing against. It's very easy to >> I'm not saying that alcoholics can stop drinking tomorrow. Why don't fat people
03:44:04
Rachel Wilsoncan just stop eating? >> Stop trying to take away responsibility from the individual. I'm not because even when things are illegal >> telling the government to do it. >> Even when things are illegal, you still have personal responsibility. How?
03:44:17
Rachel WilsonBecause people still there's people probably in this town right now doing hardcore illegal drugs >> especially in California. >> If they get caught they are going to go to jail. That's their personal choice.
03:44:28
Rachel WilsonThey are they that actually increases individual responsibility. When we take something that we know has a major negative effect on society and we say this is not going to be permitted
03:44:39
Rachel Wilsonanymore. we are putting maximum responsibility on the individual because now we're saying, "Okay, if you do this, you get caught. There's consequences. You're going to jail. You're getting fines. You're going to have to go to rehab." Whatever it is in your
03:44:51
Rachel Wilsonlibertarian utopia where we just go, "It's up to you if you want to destroy all of society or not. It's up to you if you because Okay, to throw your argument back at you, if we say we have to give
03:45:03
Driena Sixtoindividuals the choice to look at pornography, why?" >> No, I'm not saying we have to give individuals. saying we have to keep it legal. >> I'm saying >> you tried to say it was free speech.
03:45:12
Driena Sixto>> I'm saying that the reason why we can't ban it is because it sets a dangerous legal precedent. Rachel, that's the only that's not true. That's the only demonstrate it
03:45:24
Driena Sixto>> because if we again put our subjective morality as a reason for >> my morality is not subjective. Yours is. >> Um, no. Yes. We believe that pornography is bad.
03:45:36
Driena Sixto>> Perfect. Great. Fantastic. If I try to put this into law, once somebody else is in power, they're going to put something that I don't agree with into law that is based on their subjective. >> Everyone, though. Okay. So, if if you make
03:45:48
Rachel Wilson>> this is why we don't set legal precedents like that, Rachel. >> We do though. You're just >> like one. Yeah. So, let me give you an example. >> Please go ahead. >> If uh when Trump got into power this
03:46:00
Rachel Wilsonthis last round >> and he said, I'm going to say no more trans kids surgeries. Okay. And I don't know if they've actually passed a law or not. I don't remember.
03:46:10
Rachel WilsonBut let's say we did. We we banned trans uh hormones and surgeries for anyone under 18. You can't do them. >> You're saying we can't do that because then when Democrats come to power, they're going to go, "Well, you made
03:46:22
Rachel Wilsonsomething illegal, so now I'm going to take away something you like." That is not how things work. >> We have uh I will That's why you do what I'm suggesting. The reason
03:46:33
Rachel Wilsonyou do what I'm suggesting is because I have a moral epistemology and a framework that means what's immoral today is immoral tomorrow in 100 years and a thousand years from now. It
03:46:44
Rachel Wilsondoesn't change according to the culture, according to people's opinions. That's why I don't want democracy because democracy by its nature has to be progressive. You can't have conservatism
03:46:57
Rachel Wilsonin a democracy. What are you going to concern? We have we we have definitely had examples. >> What have we conservative? >> What have we conserved? >> Conservative values in a democracy. Yes, we've >> you can hold them, but you're not going
03:47:09
Rachel Wilsonto win because the whole point of it is to be endlessly progressing, endlessly going somewhere, right? So, what if we >> endlessly evolving? Yes, that is the nature of humanity.
03:47:20
Driena Sixto>> Then you're not conservative. You are progressive. That is the progressive mindset. I am a realist and things evolve and so we evolve with it.
03:47:30
Driena SixtoWhat doesn't change are our our values. And for example, saying that trans kids are >> This is blowing my mind right now. This is blowing my mind that you're letting these words come out of your mouth and
03:47:42
Driena Sixtoyou don't see the contradiction. making a law saying that children cannot be mutilated, have their genitals mutilated
03:47:49
Driena Sixtoor have their hormones altered with as minors has absolutely uh nothing. It's not an equal example to anything that I was referring to. We are just >> So if we make pornography illegal, what
03:48:02
Rachel Wilsondo you think the Democrats are going to do? >> For You think the Democrats are going to force kids to have trans surgeries? >> No. You told me we can't. Is that the equivalent or >> No, I'm you're telling me I'm doing an
03:48:13
Rachel Wilsoninternal critique of your position. I'm saying your position is well, we can't ban this thing just because we don't like it, which is not my argument. I'm not saying ban it because Rachel doesn't like it. I'm saying use a Christian moral objective framework that is
03:48:26
Rachel Wilsonuniversal for everyone and constant throughout the ages regardless of the culture or anything else. It's unchanging foundation. You're saying, "But Rachel, we can't do that because inevitably we're going to have a Democrat come to power and then they're
03:48:38
Driena Sixtogoing to get revenge on us by getting rid of something we like." >> Not we like >> that's your position. >> That that is the reality. >> And I agree. And yes, that that is the position to that when you Yes, that that's the only thing you've gotten
03:48:52
Driena Sixtoright this whole time about what I've actually said. um that yes, if we ban something we don't like because we morally disagree with it, then the left is going to do the same with us and they are going to >> But your whole thing is we morally
03:49:05
Rachel Wilsondisagree. I'm saying there's no disagreement. Right is right and wrong is wrong. There are a universal set of objective morals that Christians believe in. The reason I want Christians in
03:49:15
Rachel Wilsonpower is because they will legislate based on an based on unchanging universal standard. Well, if that happens, they're going to make pornography illegal. They're going to make sex work illegal. They're going to ban abortion. They're going to get rid
03:49:28
Rachel Wilsonof most of the drugs. They'll probably let you keep alcohol and maybe a little bit of weed. Who knows? Um, no, just the ones that can be good and can be bad. Alcohol can be used in certain contexts
03:49:39
Rachel Wilsonfor bonding and social things. It's like been part of human celebration for a long time. The Bible itself says that wine is a gift from God. Wine isn't bad.
03:49:49
Rachel WilsonMisuse of wine is bad. You can't say pornography is good, but the misuse of pornography is bad. Pornography is just bad. >> I'm not making that argument. And >> I'm saying you don't understand the difference between me saying there's
03:50:01
Rachel Wilsonthere's some things that are a tool that can be either used for good or bad. And the only thing that's bad is the misuse. I'm saying there are things that are just bad, like sex work. There's no
03:50:13
Rachel Wilsonupside to sex work, no matter how much libertarians want to argue it. >> The there's no upside. So you make it illegal. Okay, Rachel, how how are you going to How? Actually, yes. >> What do you mean prostitution is illegal? What do you mean how?
03:50:26
Rachel Wilson>> Only fans is not illegal. >> You ban it. So, where I live in I'll tell you. I live in Are you out there knocking doors? >> I live in Texas where you can't access that stuff unless you can prove you're a certain age. And what that proves is
03:50:39
Rachel Wilsonthat you can prevent people from accessing things the same way you make everything else illegal. >> If you have an only, we shut down only fans. We say you cannot operate in this country. There's other countries that have banned only fans.
03:50:51
Rachel Wilson>> And if we find a woman, >> which I think is good. >> If we find a woman producing pornography of herself, she's putting she's videotaping herself doing sex acts and putting it on the internet for people to
03:51:02
Driena Sixtobuy, we put her in jail. >> That's how would you which you know what would be let's say I agree with you on that. Would you be okay also if you catch a man consuming pornography
03:51:14
Rachel Wilsonputting him in jail? >> Yes. So that is we used to have this >> and that is valid. >> We used to have a set of laws called the comtock laws. >> Okay. So >> and so if you caught a man >> let let Rachel
03:51:26
Rachel Wilson>> if you caught a man with porn on his on his computer, >> he would have to face some kind of legal punishment as well. We'd probably do what we did with drug dealers though, which is the dealers get a much higher a
03:51:38
Rachel Wilsonmuch stricter uh punishment and the consumers of it get a lesser punishment depending on how much. What what percentage do you think of the people that are watching, which are mostly
03:51:49
Driena Sixtomale, do you think would go to jail or get punished for consuming pornography despite them agreeing on the chats and everything with most of what you're saying, but being hypocrites and actually consuming that kind of stuff.
03:52:02
Rachel Wilson>> Well, I'll tell you, I think that most of the men out there watching this, if they agree with me, there might be some like, "No, I think it should be illegal." But the ones who think it should be illegal, if if this got passed through the Congress tomorrow and they
03:52:14
Rachel Wilsonsaid, "Look, within 90 days, we're banning all pornography, if it if it goes above a topless photo." If it's more than that, or if it's or if it's a sex act, I think a lot of those guys
03:52:25
Rachel Wilsonwould actually be really happy to have their access to that cut off because then they wouldn't have to struggle as hard with having it in their face all the time. Because the problem with it now,
03:52:36
Rachel Wilson>> 100 years ago, pornography was illegal, but it was so hard to get a hold of. It was not easy to get porn. >> Now it's at our fingertips. >> Now it's the average child is first seeing it at the age of 11. And I think
03:52:48
Rachel Wilsona whole ton of people watching this would breathe a sigh of relief to know that if the government banned it and just shut down all those sites and you had to do a whole bunch of stuff. You had to work really hard to get your hands on it.
03:53:01
Rachel Wilson>> It would keep a lot of people from ever getting addicted to it in the first place. It would keep children from seeing it. It would make men who struggle with it and they they don't want to be addicted but they're struggling with it. It would make it