Feminist WANTS Traditional Man?! SHAMES "Cheap" Men Who DO NOT Pay For Dates?! | Dating Talk #190

Date: 2024-08-26

Duration: 7h 16m

Guests

Brian Atlas

PPayton (pay_irl)>

MMadison (SBCC)>

Identified Speakers

SPEAKER_00(audience)

SPEAKER_02Liz(guest)

SPEAKER_04Madison(guest)

SPEAKER_05Payton(guest)

SPEAKER_06Jordan(guest)

SPEAKER_07Brian Atlas(host)

SPEAKER_11Sarah(guest)

SPEAKER_12Stacy(guest)

SPEAKER_13Pearl(guest)

SPEAKER_14Ava(guest)

Key Moments

OtherPearl Bots sings "At Last" live on the show; studied opera (coloratura soprano).

“Brian asks Pearl to sing. She performs "At Last" (Etta James). Brian then requests Queen of the Night (Magic Flute). Pearl declines without extra compensation.”

OtherPearl's viral TikTok demonstrated live: "I use this hack to shame cheap men who split the bill."

“Brian pulls up NY Post article covering Pearl's viral TikTok (millions of views). Pearl performs the bit: when man wants to split, she says "Oh I didn't know this was a friend date." Pearl clarifies she didn't intend it as an actionable hack, just content.”

ControversyBrian argues Pearl cherry-picks leadership: wants man to lead on dates but rejects leadership when inconvenient.

“Brian points out Pearl appreciates a man who initiates, plans, and pays for dates, but resists deferring on the bikini-at-party issue. "You only want a leader when it benefits you." Pearl responds with a yin-yang model of leadership in relationships.”

ControversyExtended role-play debate: Pearl demands Brian explain WHY he doesn't want her at the party.

“Brian role-plays as Pearl's boyfriend saying "no" to her attending a party. Pearl keeps asking for more explanation. Brian argues "no" is a sufficient sentence from a leader. Pearl argues good leadership communicates reasoning. Brian accuses her of only wanting leadership when it benefits her.”

OtherPearl refuses to give a numeric self-rating, arguing women should think of themselves as tens.

“Brian asks guests to rate themselves 1-10. Pearl refuses to give a number, arguing women should operate with a "10 mindset" for confidence. Extended debate with Brian and Jordan about whether this is healthy vs delusional.”

OtherPearl announces she is a feminist; Brian and Payton push back given her preference for men to pay.

“Pearl calls herself a feminist (soft/equity definition). Payton says she is anti-feminist. Brian says Pearl's feminism is inconsistent with wanting men to pay for dates. "Just be a feminist you're a focus" — Brian says she can't have it both ways.”

OtherBody count round: Pearl 7, Jordan 7, Sarah 3; others decline.

“Viewer TTS prompts body count discussion. Jordan body count: 7 (from TTS readback). Pearl: 7. Sarah: 3. Stacy, Liz, Ava, and Madison decline to answer.”

OtherBrian reads live a text he sent to a girlfriend about vaginal odor; Madison helped write it.

“Brian recounts texting an ex about personal hygiene (vaginal odor). He reads the text verbatim. Madison helped craft it. Woman he texted broke off contact after receiving the message.”

Topics Discussed

Show intro and guest introductions

Brian opens show with standard announcements. Guests introduce name, age, location, occupation. Pearl sings "At Last" (Etta James) at Brian's request; also studied opera. Jordan, Payton, Stacy, Liz, Sarah, Madison, Ava each introduce themselves.

Relationship status round

Pearl: dating exclusively ~2 months (not official). Jordan: married 6 years. Payton: single 7 years, celibate 4 years (Catholic; returning guest, discussed before). Stacy: married 21.5 years. Liz: newly single ~3 weeks (broke up with Navy man stationed in Japan after visiting). Sarah: single; has 2 sons from an on-off relationship. Madison: in ~2-year relationship. Ava: in 5-year relationship.

Bikini/party debate: should girlfriends go to parties in bikinis?

Discussion triggered by viewer donation about girlfriend going to pool party in bikini against his wishes. Brian argues commitment-minded men reasonably limit girlfriends' attendance at singles-oriented social events. Pearl pushes back on "no" without explanation being sufficient leadership communication. Jordan and Stacy agree women should defer to partner's preferences. Role play between Brian and Pearl on the communication of a "no" in a relationship. Debate on whether women's indirect flirting (posting, going out) is analogous to men approaching.

Self-ratings round (1-10 scale)

Viewer "Stiffler" requests self-ratings. Pearl: refuses numeric, says she considers herself a 10 philosophically. Payton: delusional 10, realistic 5. Stacy: no numeric (all women are 10s framing via Sarah). Viewer TTS: Jordan body count [?], Pearl body count 7. Debate on whether women should think of themselves as 10s for confidence vs delusion.

Aging and female attractiveness

Are guests better looking now than 10 years ago? Will they be better looking in 10 years? Pearl (32): thinks she'll still be a 10 at 52. Jordan (26): thinks she looks better now. Stacy (47): confirmed better looking in youth. Brian argues biology causes female attractiveness to peak and decline.

Age gap relationships

Discussion of what constitutes an age gap (5+ years per consensus). Payton mentions older men who date younger women may be seeking someone to fund their college. Brian distinguishes comfort/guidance attraction from exploitation.

Pearl's viral TikTok: shaming men who want to split the bill

Brian pulls up NY Post article about Pearl's viral TikTok (millions of views): "I use this hack to shame cheap men who want to split the bill." Pearl demonstrates the TikTok bit: "Oh I didn't know you wanted to just be friends." Discussion of who should pay on a first date. All panelists: man should pay if he asked her out. Pearl: expects first date to be paid for, does not recommend the hack per se. Brian asks Pearl to reconcile feminist self-identification with wanting men to pay.

Women in the military / draft debate

Should women be drafted? Payton: yes (equality argument), but anti-feminist overall. Sarah: yes, drafted equally. Jordan: believes women have important role at home (especially mothers). Stacy: nuanced — both parents shouldn't be drafted from same family. Brian: supports drafting women as equality issue.

Makeup: deception or self-care?

Is wearing makeup deceptive to men? Brian argues full-face makeup is more deceptive than minimal makeup. Push-up bras mentioned similarly. Jordan: there's a difference between natural and full-beat glam. Some guests willing to remove makeup on camera; Brian says he already rated them with it on.

Man vs bear debate

Would you rather be alone with a random man or a random bear in the forest? Most guests choose bear, citing the viral TikTok. Liz says she'd pick bear but acknowledges she was influenced by the video. Ava (podcast staff) chooses man. Brian and panel discuss what percentage of men would actually harm a woman.

Feminist identity debate: Pearl vs panel

Brian challenges Pearl on calling herself a feminist while wanting men to pay for dates. Pearl clarifies she is a soft/equity feminist, not an equality-of-outcome feminist. Payton declares herself anti-feminist (does not believe in modern feminism). Brian argues Pearl cherry-picks leadership benefits without accepting leadership constraints.

Body count discussion

Does body count matter? Jordan: body count 7 (stated via TTS readback). Pearl: body count 7. Sarah: 3. Stacy and Ava: no comment. Madison declined to answer. Majority of panel said body count matters in some degree.

Telling a partner uncomfortable truths

Brian shares a text he sent to a girlfriend about vaginal odor — reads it live. Madison helped him write it. Panel discusses how to tell a friend or partner uncomfortable truths about weight, hygiene, etc. Payton: would tell a friend directly if they were gaining too much weight. WW1 trivia round closes the show.

Transcript

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Stacyolder no matter if you're married for 5 years 10 years 15 20 30 40 as a person you should want to take care of yourself and if you take care of yourself you will still be attractive to your spouse and if your spouse does the same so if

Stacyyou just allow yourself and you go you know what I got you 5 years in I've gained 40 pounds I could care less then you've now changed the dynamic of the relationship and you shouldn't be taken away what helped right in the but isn't

Sarahit implied in the Bible too that like we need that we do need to in a way like uh take care of ourselves in order to

Jordanserve our husbands onor our Temple yeah definitely I mean I feel like for me the way that i' I have like viewed it is like how my husband met me and the

Jordanvalues I held going into saying my vows the day of the marriage are the same values that I should carry out into my marriage I shouldn't just change who I am and my values just because I'm

Jordanmarried and oh yeah I gotcha you know we're married now like I can just give up on myself like that's not fair to me that's not fair to him and he shouldn't do the he shouldn't do the same thing or

Paytonhe should do the same thing take care of himself were you guys just as confident before you were with the person you're with now no I wasn't and that's why I'm

Stacysaying I met my husband when I was 24 I got married when I was 25 I was um way heavier I didn't have much confidence um my looks were way different and over the

Stacylast 21 years my weight's gone up it's gone down it's gone up but I'm much better now than I was back then but I had to find it myself and he was there to support me I want to ask the uh the

Brian Atlas10 the nine and the 10 it's beautiful uh I want you guys to rape me on a scale of 1 to 10 my looks the 10 and the nine can you tilt your mic down

Brian Atlasyeah I don't I don't like that go ahead I won't be offended oh I don't think that you'll be offended I won't be offended I know that you won't be offended okay go ahead pass Jordan give

SPEAKER_08me a rating um he's fixing himself I'm going to give you I'm going to give you a solid

Jordansix I I I don't want to rate you that's just mean it's not mean go ahead he's asking for it he clearly doesn't care if we get offended lay it on him are you

Jordantrying to justify he's putting himself in a position to be judged he asked for it think about it he said he looked at us and was like none of you are 10 so

SarahI'm going to say five but only because like values differ no looks just looks forget the Val she's like still five 5 and a

Jordanshe's all three no no no because I'm the type like I [Music] honestly the way he stared into the camera when I need to preface this

Sarahbecause you take black eyes no I need to no I need sorry Desmond you could be literally the most like handsome man in the entire world and if like it it's just not it you would still be a one to

Sarahme if that makes sense does that make sense that's a lie because a lie I just I just lied to myself and to all of y'all but it's

Sarahfine was a lie somebody translate translate I'm just going to say it's a six for me a six oh we agreed see go

Brian Atlasahead six I already gave my answer all right pearl all right pearl Let's uh are we done with we got chats okay let's do the pre-show notes then we got pre-show notes we got to get through the not

Brian Atlasnotes guys we're going to react to pearls viral video New York Post Tik Tok millions of views Yep

Brian Atlasuhhuh music career Okay I uh pull up the New York Post article from Pearl I use this hack to shame cheap men

Brian Atlaswho want to split the bill guys say it's manipulative now who's manipulative Pearl oh I mean guys definitely say it's manipulative I'll talk I'll I'll I'll

Brian Atlasget my scroll down a bit Nick scroll down scroll down this 100% genius hack will get 50/50 cheapos in check splitting the bill on a first date has become a topic of

Brian Atlascontention one Shady dator has devised oh my God literation all the okay one Shady dator has devised a deliciously devious trick oh man I bet she was

Brian Atlasvery exuberant over that okay that's sure to leave tightfisted fellas with egg on their face what when a man actually just go to the video nick uh pull up the Tik

Brian AtlasTok next next page let's see

Pearlit when a man wants to go 50/50 with you on a date do this oh my

PearlGod I'm so embarrassed right now um wait you wanted to just be friends I'm so confused this whole

Pearlentire time I thought this was a date oh my God okay I'm so sorry here's my

Madisoncard I see how that works I see how it works see how it works I can see that now um so you want a traditional guy right uh I wouldn't say that I want a

Pearltraditional guy no but you want a guy to pay for First Dates I would like somebody to pay for the first date yes why um because the kind of man that I'm looking

Pearlfor I'm looking for like the father of my children life partner somebody who has ambition leadership qualities like someone who has like honestly like a job

Pearlwhere he could you know where he's like looking for a wife someone who wants to take care of a wife and his children and like if I get pregnant with his babies that it's we're not going to be if we get married you know like M um

Pearlso I think like to me I don't think of like it being modern versus traditional I just think like what kind of energy do I want what kind of man do I want and I think

Pearlthe standard that I have is that if a man asked me out on a date I would expect that like out of courtesy he would take care of it that's just what I want do I actually think that women

Pearlshould use this as a hack to get men to pay for them no I think that women should live in such a way and have the kind of energy where that if a man asked them out and they had a conversation it would just that's just what they would

Pearlwant to do and if they don't want to do it that's totally fine but I would just really probably see that person as a friend that's just a standard that I have for myself oh if you want to split the bill on the first date like we're

Pearlprobably just not a long-term match do I think you should actually use this like I said last time I was here no I think this was a skit to illustrate a standard and a standard is different than manipulation I see how people could take

Pearlit as me giving them a hack like the Shir 7 kind of stuff but I personally didn't intend it to be that I had no idea it was going to blow up the way that it did um but yeah my standard is

Pearlif a man asks me on a date he he's picking it it could be coffee it could be an expensive dinner it could be a walk like and I get to say yes or no to the date but if he planned it and he picked it the very first thing I feel

Brian Atlaslike a good impression is to take care of the bill well regardless of whether you intend to employ this with this hack uh I never called it a hack that's what all the posts and all the people in the

Brian Atlascomments called it regardless of whether you actually employ this oh you want to split the bill I didn't know you wanted to just be friends I mean the sentiment is still there right so if a guy did want to split the bill there wouldn't be

Brian Atlasa second date correct uh yeah probably not if he did split the bill went to coffee and he's like hey can you VMO me six bucks I'd be like no he doesn't say but he goes in he

Brian AtlasERS his thing he arrives before you and then you arrive he doesn't go ahead and pay for your I just assume it's not a date I would assume that that's for friend that would be like a friend thing

Brian Atlasbut what what if he like overtly uses communication and says no this is a date I am romantically and sexually interested in you yeah I would be very surprised and yeah I probably wouldn't

Brian Atlaswant to date him even though cuz cuz you're saying well I wouldn't date him again because he he wants to be friends but he's saying well I don't want to be friends I actually want to date you but I also don't want to pay for your

Brian Atlasyeah I wouldn't like that fair enough going around the table who should pay on the first date

SPEAKER_03men I think either sure if he asks him okay men men men men okay

Paytonso could I also just ask her one question sure have you ever paid on a first date um when I was younger and more easily manipul

Pearlyes did you want to pay but now no I haven't I haven't had to my friends I mean even my male friends they like I never I just I never pay for myself wait I have I have a question you said when

Pearlyou were younger and you dating guys like you would split yeah I might offer I think the majority of the times men would did you ever hook up with any of these

Pearlguys that didn't pay I don't know I don't I don't know I don't remember you don't

Pearlremember not pro I don't think so no huh I don't think I ever did to be honest it was it wasn't a it wasn't a normal occurrence but it it did happen a few

Pearltimes um before but now it never happens ever and I never talk about it I never say it never happens this was the big point of contention on the previous show uh would you take your husband's last

Pearlname oh yeah we were talking about that I uh I would I would take my husband's last name that wasn't your answer though the previous time my answer was I don't know like I was just like saying I don't know and then I got a huge reaction from

Pearlit I was like oh I didn't even know that it mattered that much to men and then we had this whole thing but I was like oh I I truly didn't even know that it would matter that much but yeah if I if my husband wanted me to take his last name

Brian Atlaslike I have no problem there a conversation about it what do you have to justify it no I don't think so if we're getting married I thought I thought there had to be a conversation like he just said you're taking my last

Pearlname I don't you're taking it that's just like a weird vibe you said men should pay I'd say that's what I want you have to pay for first AIDS I wouldn't approach it like that I would

Pearlsay that that's what I want and if he was like that's this I would prefer like I really want you to take my last name it means this to me it means I'd be like okay didn't you say that well it I'd have to determine if his last name was cool enough didn't you say that I did

Pearlsay that yeah but I don't think that's actually not true though now you said that though I said that and I'm allowed to evolve and change my opinion absolutely and I think that that would totally be great with me even if he had

Pearlan ugly ass last name I would still take it if he if it really meant a lot to him well I'm glad we had that impact on you I'm glad you so much the whatever podcast Chang my life you're welome you're very welcome but we it was we did point out

Brian Atlasthat when we brought this conversation up and you're like well I don't know I don't think I mean depends on his last name I have to think about it and then we said hold on you don't want to take my last

Brian Atlasname oh I didn't know that this was a friend date I didn't know you wanted to just be friends yeah that was funny I remember that that was a good one it was a good one good one yeah just just be friends I'm a changed

Brian Atlaswoman yeah you should you should thank me for this I did I literally just did yeah it's good it's

Pearlgood uh so okay um I'm why should men pay um men can do whatever they they want I would prefer personally if my man

Pearlwas the kind of man who would want to take care of a first date they don't have to then they can date someone else yes but so wants to do that like why why should it be that men should pay for

Pearlfirst aides why do I like that in a man and why do I prefer that yeah why should men pay for I'm not saying that all men should do anything if they want if a if there's a 50-50 man who doesn't

Brian Atlaswant to pay on the first date for whatever reason would you tell one your girl he should get he should be paired with a woman who also wants to do that they can go ahead and do that in your female friend group what would you prescriptive

Brian Atlasprescriptively tell your female friends if if you're giving her advice and a guy did this you wouldn't you would be like well if that's the arrangement you want or would you prescriptively say he's not

Pearlthe guy for you I would say what do you want and if she was like I'd prefer if that if he paid for it I would say okay what if she didn't know if she didn't didn't know and she was going to you for guidance what would you tell her um I

Pearlmean I think that men who want to take care of the first date are like typically you know have I think it's like related and correlated to like leadership abilities and like men who don't want to pay for the first date I

Pearlfeel like are probably have been like burned by women like have been maybe manipulated or taken advantage of financially and are like skeptical of women which is totally fair I think that

Pearlthere totally are women who use men for their money um so I think that you know that they should have that discussion like you know and decide what they want sure going around the table why should men

Jordanpay well just to um make my answer a little bit more clear if a man asks you out whoever is asking the person out should be paying

Jordanbecause you are essentially taking initiative and for me in a man I like a who takes initiative I like a man who can take you know charge of a situation whether good or bad and if we're on a

Jordangood date you know we're both trying to get to know each other and that's great but at the end of the day if you have set this date to happen then you got to see it through and pay for the bill you

Madisondo understand though that it's mostly men who do take the initiative though of course I do I'm just say Brian would that yeah um I take the advice from my father

Paytonand he says that if you're on a first date if they did ask you then they should pay but if they want to split it then that's fine it doesn't it shouldn't really matter whether you split it or or

Paytonor they pay like I've been on dates and I've I've offered to pay and I've paid the whole bill like just out of you know courtesy whoever offers do make you feel any way about that person no okay that's

Jordangood I've done the same thing I've paid for bills and I it's not something I get upset over it's a preference but it's not something I would get you know offended over okay and I stated if he asks then he

Lizshould pay so I go along with the same thing MH uh yeah me too I think that whoever takes initiative should definitely pay the bill first um I think it would be weird if he like asked me out on a date

Jordanand then he was like all right here's the here's the check like be like he should even let you see it he shouldn't even let you see it he should just grab it and not even let you see what it not even split it I think is fair you know

Lizwhat though I went on I like initiated a date and he like he paid for the bill without me even looking and I was like oh my gosh like this man is like amazing

Brian AtlasI mean I still think he's amazing but yeah even when women initiate they'll still get the treatment uh you know what I think you know it's fair would do you

Brian Atlasguys make this trade We Men we continue to be initiators but you guys pay for the whole date that's fair right yeah like we have to do the burden of

Sarahasking you out why is that a burden it's a burden it's not it's not a burden is it something that has to be done well if it's a burden you don't want her enough I think it is a burden it's work it's a

Brian Atlasburden it it it's work to approach somebody to be rejected but it's not a burden set a panel of women who have never been

Brian Atlasrejected after don't say bur that's the wrong word wait none of you ever like have you ever been to a party yeah have you ever been to a party have guys ever approached you have you

Brian Atlasever been to a party where you rejected every single guy who approached you yeah mhm and do you think like there were other girls at the party that also rejected them mhm and then like boom

Brian Atlasrejection rejection rejection have any of you ever been to a party and approached man after man after man and been projected and had the

Jordanyeah but I'm also holding the burden of feeling bad for rejecting you that's a not a party but like oh my sweet so much child oh my God I hate it I hate it every time it hurts

Brian Atlaswomen Love Actually women love rejecting that no I but also I don't know if women would necessarily validation it's validation sorry you're not attractive

Sarahenough why did you horrible do you not remember that like it was good woman you an actual number like 5 minutes ago

Jordanit is hard to re it's it's hard when you like no I don't want to be I'm like I appreciate you coming over here I know it took a lot of guts but they're still getting rejected but I'm still yes but

Jordanmy my delivery is very sweet and kind and it's hard for me to do that I actually have a hard time saying no just as a general bro you're married chill out no no no no

Pearlno it's hard for her bro she's married what I understand what you mean no no no not like that not like that I mean I just have a hard time saying no I mean it it still is harder for the man though to be

Jordanrejected for sure I agree with it actually is I agree which is which is not necessarily a negative tra bur here let's role play you and me okay pick me up go ahead I'm the chick you're the

Stacydude go ahead give me a wig somebody you got this there oh and hold on oh what the heck a baby hold you're wondering where the baby came in trying

Brian Atlasto think of a good trying to think of a good pickup line what the you know I've been getting a lot of crit I've been getting a lot of

Brian Atlascriticism um that you know we have we previously had a black baby and a white baby I've been getting a lot of flack

Brian Atlasonline I sometimes give Madison a child so we have Nick can you put it on this camera so weird I've purchased to be

Brian Atlasconsiderate and be diverse I purchased an Asian baby wait reallyy she got so excited that's an

Brian AtlasAsian baby Ryan's got two different baby M so okay so hold on um let's role play you have two children so I'm you these are your two sons these are your two

Stacysons what's the best way to hold a child that's not like that it's not a basketball like you love switch is this perfect no what

Lizare you going to do when you become a dad oh I understand so okay I'm you I'm you that I understand why you went to court for

Stacythat crle all right I'm you cradle hold on okay there I'll just put them there what yeah cuz they at that young they'll just sit uport their own wait all right

Brian Atlasoh my gosh pick me up let's go well I'm not going to no respectable person will probably pick you up with your children right there it's you're two newborn

Brian Atlasthey're in the not my respect person don't worry they're not actually here they're just they don't talk you have two kids I have two kids you're the man

SarahI'm the woman go ahead wait what I'm the man you're the man pick me up

Stacyum um hello my lady you like lady from the Renaissance ages you need one of the helmet helmet that was a Renaissance term right

Brian Atlasthere tip tip the tip the Fedora no like do a when you say my lady do a little tip tip it there you go okay go ahead you're doing good so far go ahead um can I take you out to dinner

Sarahsometime wow that's very cor um I suppose I wow that was easy weren't you have looking at him thanks I'll call

Sarahyou Friday aren't you going to get my number like you tath this is oh we're going to do the whole thing okay yeah you got to do the whole thing what you think it is can I can I get your can I give you my snap can I get your number

Sarahcan I give you my snap I'd rather give you my snap still use Snapchat respectfully don't use Snapchat oh I guess you can follow me on

SarahInstagram here you go is that your I would actually like to seriously pursue you so if you want I will take your number I will call you and we can set up a dinner no none of that you just go

Brian Atlasstraight to the point don't you you're making me way more promiscuous than I was hoping for a little conversation but you just want to

Brian Atlasgo straight to getting my digits what is bad that's not bad tell you what I'll give you my Instagram here it is at

Sarahbig booty 13 all right you know what it's actually looking like you're not the type of woman that I'd actually want for myself but you have a great

Brian Atlaswhatever based on based on that uh username damn I feel terrible M lady lady that was awesome you open with

JordanM lady me you open with Mady I'm just making you look so good that was her opener my gosh put your you have to wear the Fedora the rest of the show are you serious I am dead serious give her the

Lizlook like Michael Jackson with oh my gosh no she looks like she's about to do a jazz she Jaz iess you have to wear that helmet so you look you actually look cute this

Sarahlooks like I look like Michael blé but like it's a good look Michael it's a good look Michelle BL anyways uh let's

Brian Atlas[Laughter] seea so um oh oh yeah yeah the Tik toks we got more Tik toks Pearl over here go

Pearlahead you want to be the best partner a man has ever had absolutely obsessed with you to wake up every single day and you need to be the first person who's on your mind you're doing your own thing

Pearlyou're accomplishing your own goals you're living your life for yourself you've decentered him him you've decentered men in general you know who you are you like who you are the ways in which you don't know how to love

Pearlyourself are going to be projected onto your partner so taking inventory and auditing every part of your life and saying where can I love myself more is

Pearlgoing to help you be the best woman any man has ever had hey erous erroneous what the you're wearing the same shirt the yeah you were wearing the same wow

Madisonthat's embarrassing what same jacket show hey Maddie shots fired

Pearlrude um he's like what does Des centered men mean what does that mean I think that um women grow up like we we saw I mean

Pearlat least I did Growing Up In Media where it's like the woman like discovers her confidence when the man tells her she's beautiful and it's like we're always externalizing and um seeking validation

Pearlfrom outside sources and instead of finding it from within and I think when you learn to validate yourself and you learn to just like love yourself for who

Pearlyou are your mistakes your flaws where you're at in life and to just like be your own be the person who you're you

Pearlyou are your safest place and the person that you're wanting to love you if you can love yourself in that way I find that you tend to attract people who will

Pearllove you in that way and if you think of yourself as like I don't know not worthy or like not beautiful then you tend to attract people who kind of are going to

Pearlmanipulate you or use you or not really value you in the same way so I find that how you think of yourself is typically projected into like the people that you trct both friendships and relationships so if you want somebody to like be completely and utterly and totally

Pearlobsessed with you which I feel like everybody does then really completely and totally being obsessed with yourself in the sense that not that you think that you're better than other people or

Pearlthat in compar comparison to other people you know you're somehow superior but saying I am who I am as I am and I accept myself and I like that about me I like how I handle my mistakes I like how

PearlI handle my failures and I'm okay with me as I am you tend you'll attract people who think in the same way and do you did anybody stop

Paytonlistening like 10 seconds do you K do you think that everyone should think that way or that's just your personal views for yourself I think that most women um I mean it it depends

Pearlon who the woman is like but I think most women we all have to go on a journey of like self-confidence and self growth and self-love and understanding that our worth doesn't come from anything exterior or we don't have to

Pearlexternalize it or get validation from other people and it's funny cuz when we do go on that Journey we tend to actually get more valid validation we tend to actually get more love from other people so whenever I see a woman

Pearlwho keeps attracting men in her life who are like kind of like toxic or just like aren't treating her well it's usually CU she has low self-esteem when her she doesn't think she's a 10 when her self-esteem grows she typically attracts

Paytonmen who honor her and who cherish her and who respect her what if you just don't have confidence you don't really you're just like okay you're like fine with whoever you are and that's confidence you think yeah yes that is

Pearlwhat confidence is it's being fine with who you are as you are and also maybe seeing the things that maybe aren't so good about you maybe you are toxic maybe you are somebody who doesn't who you

Pearlknow I don't know is a bad friend or whatever and being like I'm kind of a bad friend I'm going to work on that but it's okay I'm working on it I'm growing I'm going to you know become better in this area but you know I am I am as I am

Stacyyou know I mean how many how many women here your first boyfriend your first boyfriends were pretty crappy or def better so that has a lot to do with the fact that you you haven't

Stacyfigured anything out you don't know anything better you don't have don't think much of yourself hence that's where the guys come in and they treat the women like crap now if you that doesn't grow if you don't grow as a person you continue to attract that kind

Pearlof person as you get older these are things that yes you're going to have that when you're younger but you should not continue to have that when you get older cuz when you think well of yourself you don't accept behavior from

Pearlother people um in the same way so if you think oh I'm unworthy then you're going to track men who treat you like you're unworthy but if you think no I'm I'm a an amazing person like I love this

Pearlabout me I love this about me like I've grown in this way I've been with myself through all these obstacles and mistakes you're going to attract people who treat you like that wait hold on you said I'm an amazing person I view myself as an

Brian Atlasamazing person isn't there some sort of some degree of tangibility or objectivity when it comes to you being an amazing person like are you just an amazing person because

Brian Atlasyou're a person or do you actually have to be like have redeeming qualities about you I think you do have to have redeeming qualities you I I mean but I'm

Brian Atlasconfused about the whole I need to view myself as amazing well I can to get the best guy yeah

Pearlthat's that's how you talk by the way just kidding um it's a tough tonight yeah um so yeah I do believe that when you think of yourself and you

Pearlrespect yourself you have self-respect you have self-worth you're going to attract men and you're going to reject men who don't see you with self-worth and self-respect and that's why as you age your standards become higher typically if you're self-aware and

Pearlyou're thinking about yourself you don't have to be delusional you can say I'm amazing because I've healed this trauma I've grown in discipline I I've grown in character I've like read all these books

Pearland I've learned from all these Wise Women I've you know grown this business for myself there are things that you can point out in your life that grow your confidence and they're usually and I don't need other people to say you're

Pearlbeautiful you're this in order to feel worthy cuz I could just tell myself cuz I see myself and I've been through all of my difficulties with myself the entire time I was going to agree with Brian though because I just wasn't

Paytonunderstanding like you were saying something like you accept accept who you are and everything but then you also were saying like oh I'm such a good person and I'm this and I'm that is

Paytonthere do you really think that's also confidence or cuz I feel like some people just say I am who I am that's it it's not like oh I'm this great person they're not like really you know

Pearlthinking these good things about themselves they're just they are who they are I think they've settled yeah I think it's good to think of yourself highly and I think it's not not based off that aren't based in reality but you

Stacyshould also want to think good things about yourself yeah it's good you should value yourself you should be like hey I got this promotion hey you know if you work out I hit a new personal record hey

StacyI've lost 10 pounds you mention that you've lost weight that should be something that you're very much proud of so it's okay to be um proud of yourself for your accomplishments it

Jordan[Music] doesn't I think yeah I think confidence is definitely like I wasn't talking about me personally I'm just saying I was just I think she I think to what

Jordanyou're saying is like should there being happy with who you are and stop I'm trying to get the thought out let me get it out can you guys let me

Brian Atlasmove it on hold on all right guys therapy let's wrap up the therapy session please go ahead make your point let me move it on to

Jordansomething let me talk oh my God so is that you should be yes you should have confidence and value yourself everybody should value themselves but not at the

Jordanexpense of settling and just saying oh yeah I'm I'm happy with where I'm at and I'm good with who I am and this is me but yet you have no goals no Ambitions

Jordanyou're not doing anything about changing fixing growing it shouldn't be at the absence of not trying to be better like there's a difference between being confident but confidence has to come

Jordanwith the action as well the action of doing better for yourself having goals for yourself accomplishing things like you can't just be delusional and be like yeah you know I am happy with who I am

Lizand I do value myself but yet your actions don't reciprocate that okay Brian your turn no that makes sense what you she's literally playing cards now

Pearlthat's so rude huh so this is a pod this is a podcast you're supposed to be listening to me I'm sorry I'm sorry responding I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm no that's just who you are I think you should be who you are if you're uninterested in these kinds of things do

Brian Atlasit sorry sorry you are who you are confident I didn't know so on for I did not know that was on camera I am sorry that is so rude Jordan I

Brian Atlasam I'd like to take this chance to apologize to absolutely nobody okay so what was your next point I want to go to Jordan actually

Brian AtlasJordan what I need some recover we'll come back to them really quick Jordan Brian mentioned that women should be drafted I highly disagree with that so raise your hand here at the table who highly disagrees

Brian Atlasthat women should be drafted along with the men equality disagre disagree disagree that women should OHL you're leaving for getting up for this one you don't want to have the draft

Brian Atlasconversation everybody knows what I think come on she wants women to be on the front line unless they like absolutely uh disagree women should not be drafted not be drafted you're in

Paytonfavor of the draft for women w w in favor of the draft is this like if like you're a feminist it's just general if you think women and men should both be

Sarahdrafted if it came down to it men women should be drafted exactly like men women should have the opportunity to to get drafted if they want to be drafted well that's the point of a draft is that you

Sarahdon't you don't have a choice you're forced no then no okay I want the choice to be forced to do

Jordansomething you know what I mean yeah like I want to choose or you know whether or not I want to be forced to do something that's fair but but yeah

Jordanbut then like I feel like everyone would choose to not be drafted and then I feel like women like I should be forced but also not yeah I totally agree okay I feel like it would be highly

Brian Atlasineffective oh for sure because women are you would kill it on the front L women are you would some people up bro I can I would not be able to look somebody in the eyes be a 10 be self-confident you're not are you not

Stacyself-confident and your ability to do hand toand combat with an insury you could win the war but there are so many different jobs it's not everybody has to be in the

Sarahfront L okay if you sent a bunch of a bunch of women

Sarahof H little they're way too long you could somebody up with that go ahead sorry women women are just more emotionally like they function more

Sarahemotionally cry yeah shoot them and cry s how dare you pray for them and then shoot them no okay yeah but like am I right like would we if it was like us

Sarahagainst like a bunch of men and I'm not saying it's because men are like more terrible it's just they are not going to sit there and like yeah but if we were forc we wouldn't have a choice

Brian Atlaswe just have to do it yeah we wouldn't have a choice but still we would just have to do what we have to do to win the war I honestly think we we should draft women first soften up the enemy then the

Stacymen go in we're supposed to only partial uniforms to get their minds off of war is that where you're going with that are you talking about what I was just saying they have them

Stacythey have the women seduce everyone and then they come and kill them would that I wonder if that would like Be an Effective let's discuss well I mean if you think about it how long have men been out at War right okay imagine so

Brian Atlasjust even seeing a woman would be like so imagine your all of us at once we just flash them imagine you're a soldier chat chat

Brian Atlasimagine you're a soldier and you're a sniper and see a a woman in camo without a top are you taking the shot or are you kind of waiting a little bit he's going

SPEAKER_00to wait I don't know if he takes the shot he might be like depends what his commands are he's going to look for a second and that's when the other girl do he take the shot of Serial donated

SPEAKER_00$200 men have forced military conscription cannot vote unless we sign Selective Service true women can vote for people who would send men to the front line this alone should say women should pay

Jordanfirst but like I feel like as women we have an important role to like especially we have kids to like stay home be with the kids and I think like if women were drafted and the men had to

Jordanstay home with the kids like I just I don't think that that would be the most ideal situation I think it be better for wom to be home with the kids that would be super ideal

Stacyfor the men are you saying like for both are you both parents are just saying one or the other cuz that's one of the things they used to do for the draft was that they

Stacywould never take like if they had three both parents or if they had three sons they would not take all three or if two passed they would bring the third one home so that they didn't have to go back

Brian Atlasto the families and say you're now wiped out all your children mhm yeah yeah they just took one I think we're going to start the draft and the higher you rate

Lizyourself on the look scale the you're the first if you're a 10 you get to go you get drafted first so we're because

Brian Atlasyou're the most confident we need listen we need confident soldiers here we need confident women and confident soldiers you're a 10 out of 10 slay Queen not

Stacyslay Queen get that in the crosshairs you got that queen go off drizzle drizzle although I'm going to say Jordan would she would be a badass though I'm sorry Jordan she would she'd be badass Jordan would people

Brian Atlasup Rush she would somebody up and then for she be able to like lift him with one hand oh yeah so she would annihilate she would annihilate them yeah yeah

Brian Atlasthat's why we should draft Jordan look at me with my dainty you don't want me you don't want me with my dainty Man Hands going to war we need Jordan over there I forgot that you say if it was

Jordanhere let's do a hands no actually let's not let's not compare hands yes I would I would keep so that other woman can stay home that is and they' be like thank you you are Patriot you are a

Pearlpatriot you are I think we need to send Pearl to the front Pearl you going on the front line no one wants me protecting the country in that way with all your confidence yes that was funny though that

Brian Atlaswas a lot of these male soldiers they don't have half the confidence you have we need you on the front line sorry entally go join the yeah maybe I'll

Brian Atlasthink about it you should join the military can she join any military is she too old no offense no she's not she too old for the military can you go into the military at

Brian Atlas37 32 sorry sorry 32 32 my bad my bad I'm sorry I'm sorry 32 can you go into the military chat any soldiers in the chat military can she go in at 32 or is

Pearlshe um military needs can she volunteer I think oh it needs that depends which branch which branch it can up to 41 huh it depends what branch milary going to

Brian Atlasbe way longer if they I want her she's going to be a marine first she's going to be first to the front line a marine maybe Air Force Air Force that's the

PearlMarines are the first you could s infantry could be in like the the band like the Army Band or whatever the what the band they have like a music thing I'll be in the Army Band band yeah the

Brian Atlasmilitary they they have like a they have like musicians maybe actually I won't even do that don't quit your I won't D trust me I won't very competitive oh

Brian Atlasmy gosh very competitive we not me for I think men are drafted for a reason this was all thought out actually I really don't think a terrible reason we need to start honestly I think they thought about it I think they just did because

Stacythey didn't value women very much this is what I would like to see it this is what I like to see but I think women are better off at home with the kids than

Jordanmen thank you Jordan good I think you're so mean to me today I'm not mean he said I love you earlier he did say I love you I'm getting

Brian Atlasbipolar it's like you love me you love me not going to send the women we're going to send the women to war but they can't have any guns or anything so you

Brian Atlasjust have to fight like this yeah I said I would sacrifice are fighting other go to war for other wom then that'd be fair yeah it's just that's how we Wars that' be fine yeah woman on woman yeah okay

Brian Atlasall right good talk uh we have desert Joe so much prattle so much cope Z he's he's sleepy yoer Joe thank you for the

Brian Atlasmessage man appreciate it dude appreciate it brother we have I'm waiting for it to uh come I'm going to have Jordan read this because I was mean to

Jordanher I meant I am watching you talk trash you say I'm only only using one part then tell me the other part does a church go out clubbing in a bikini what am I saying is out of context can only

Stacytype so much who's this directed to I don't know I like don't even know original question I mean it just came aik seems like that person is taking different bit and pieces

Brian Atlasabout again with the grammar again with the words again with the not forming sentences correctly okay well ink thank you for the 1776 appreciate the uh stream message

Brian Atlasman thank you we have Craig eled Edelman go ahead Jordan sent it the same one oh it's the

Jordansame one Craig all right all right thanks Craig we already read it but thank you Craig for the super the girl in red is the only realistic woman there if they want to mix personality with

Paytonlooks then she wins hands down the other Goofs have zero logic oh that's do any of you want to respond to the y'all are goofs shot you can ask him out thank you would

Jordanyou like to date me oh damn okay all right hey have you ever had a confidence

Jordanshe went for it she went for it see perfect example of confidence he's very patri thank you apprciate Stars vest right okay we

Brian Atlastalked about the draft I think women should be drafted only fair I am a feminist and believe inequality uh you said Brian doesn't think women should wear

Jordanmakeup is that a fact Brian I think the world would be a better place if there was no makeup is that like the pressing issue of society

Brian Atlasin the world do you do you care about the environment Jordan yeah do you care about the environment I do do you by the way really quick this is totally

Brian Atlasunrelated are there any pman pulmonologists watching the show because I have I have a question if you're p p pul pulmonologist can you DM me what's

Brian Atlasthat I think it's a doctor with the the lungs who focuses on the lungs a pulmonary doctor pulmonary pulmonologist

Brian Atlaswhy I shoot slant my you need he I know do you have problems with your lungs what's going on I got a question I got a question I'm not going to talk about on the show but I got a question question oh no that

Brian Atlasdoesn't sound good don't worry about it so um makeup yeah I'm against makeup just against it as a whole don't think it

Jordanshould deceptive it's kind of deceptive you know I agree that it can be used to a degree that can completely alter and

Jordanchange a woman's looks but I think there's a range and it's fluid like you like I said you can wear makeup and it can look be a soft Glam like for example when I came on the

Jordanfirst podcast and I took my makeup off like a lot of the a lot of the other girls on the panel were like hey there's not too much big of a difference because I don't cake my face with like all of

Jordanthis pounds of makeup to be fair the lighting in here does wonders for the women not for me I'm so red to be fair lighting can't cover and the lighting in here does a

Stacylot of f lighting can't cover ugly apprciate the lighting our our camera setup is doing a lot of favors for the women who come on this show so I I want to ask all the lighting in the world you

Stacycan't go if you if you feel that strongly about makeup in women yeah when you see a woman walking down the street what attracts you to her is just

Stacyher body because makeup is because her face that's what attracts men to women is

Stacytheir face they see their face first sure so you men you men are the reason why we've had to do this you don't seem to understand that and that's cuz as

Stacyyoung girls we see it on TV we hear it that is why we go to fashion magazines that's why we go to makeup that's why we want it we don't just wake up as a you

Stacyknow wake up as a baby we're not just born as a baby and go makeup it's what we learn and we learn it from what we but a lot of women say I don't wear makeup for

Sarahmen so these are two kind of like I I could actually argue that like I think a lot of other women wear makeup because other women wear makeup does that make

Sarahsense like I feel like so for example like I actually don't wear makeup I'm wearing makeup today and when I wear makeup like I wear makeup but typically I don't wear makeup like I mean Liz

Sarahknows she knows me personally I never wear makeup makeup you know but to be completely transparent I wore makeup because I was like other women are probably going to wear makeup but

Sarahwhen you were a teenager 11 years old 12 years old 13 14 why did you start I think the norm would have actually been because like I

Stacywas being influenced by my friends to do it like I did they learn it that's what I'm saying it's an influence yeah and it doesn't doesn't come from your parents it doesn't come from your siblings

Brian Atlasnormally wait but you're okay going back to your original argument you were saying that women do the makeup thing because like men care about a woman's face right yes I think it could come

Brian Atlasfrom the parents though but well you see your mother wearing probably if you see your mother wearing makeup so to get to the point of it uh but would if women

Brian Atlascare about a man's Career Success is he then justified in lying about his his career so like a guy works at McDonald's knowing that women are attracted to

Paytonsuccessful men he lies on a dating app or in person and says well I'm a lawyer well it would be a lot easier women are attracted to it would be a lot easier to keep up with your makeup every day than keeping up that you work at McDonald's

Stacyinstead of being a lawyer I think a guy could pull it off it's you should test that out I don't think it's the same extent I don't think wearing makeup is about your career are the same things

Brian Atlasactually think of make yeah I don't think those are really compar I don't think they're a good comparison so I actually think though that the impact of that makeup will have in terms of the

Brian Atlasimpact it will have on the man being more attracted to you is more significant than a man lying about his job no yes eventually he's going to see you without makeup equal well I have

Brian Atlasmore of an issue yeah you trapped him you manipulated him you manipulator you manipulated into a relationship I want to ask you also why

Pearlis it dumb why is it dumb cuz cuz you want to defend the paint you're paint I just don't care like this is just a dumb conversation you don't like the

Pearlconversation men who are so obsessed with like how much makeup women are wearing or not wearing it's like you're it's just I just find that I personally find that unattracted women

SPEAKER_00who are obsessed with men who deceive them by lying killer of cereal donated $200 get some get some stay hydrated

SPEAKER_00stay alive beautiful keep life in perspective live within your means trust in your purpose thrive in your drive Institute Instinct stay based vet

Brian Atlaseveryone keep it real uh yo KB cial thank you for tuning in tonight man really appreciate all your support thank you for the uh TTS that was beautiful you you are Shakespeare in the flesh

Brian Atlasbeautiful um men who are obsessed with the makeup thing is what but so okay I just find it boring we have you ever personally hooked up with a woman and

Paytonnot seeing her without makeup every time she she puts on makeup somehow like even after whatever she goes and takes a shower and she puts on makeup before you see her again like has someone done that into

Brian Atlaswhich you have not seen them without makeup and it's altered your reality of seeing how they look well this is difficult one because I tend to prefer women who wear minimal

Brian Atlasor no makeup although I've dated women who wear um and makeup but that is totally within your control to answer your question that prence I don't think

Brian Atlasthat there's a woman that I've been with where I where but again this could come down to my general preference for women who wear minimal or no makeup I've not been with a woman and then she removes the makeup I'm

Paytonlike damn she's busted and you're able to tell like that she's wearing a certain amount of makeup like when you see an attractive woman and you ask her out whatever and it'll depend on if you

Paytoncan tell how much makeup that she's currently wearing what's the qu I'm sorry I don't understand the question do you base it off of when you see a woman and you can

Brian Atlasnotice that she's wearing too much makeup so you won't ask her out like sure yeah actually I mean if I see her on the dating app or in person like a woman who's wearing what in my view is too much makeup I probably wouldn't pursue her just not really my type okay

Brian Atlasbut like if she's wearing a bit of makeup then uh it's okay it's not a it's not a deal breaker I just didn't guys were able to I do prefer minimal or no makeup

Brian Atlasbut if she's attractive without it what harm is it if she wears and and is still attractive well I mean there's a couple things one this is this is anotal most guys probably don't care from this angle maybe they do maybe the CH and weigh in

Brian Atlasactually one of the reasons I don't like it is if she wears a bunch of on her face and it rubs off on me I'm prone to acne I don't want her getting on me and we're making out and then I have

Jordanacne breakout or some because of her paint and then also my pillowcases out of here or your shirts she I mean you shouldn't sleep in makeup but well if we're in bed laying down she's

Jordannot you know what I mean you you take off take off the pillow sheets I don't know but if you if you have't KN an acne say like okay you know that's understandable and I'm sure

Jordanshe I just don't even like that on my skin to be honest you don't put on makeup before you come into the studio they're legitimate reasons honestly I mean that's legitimate and that's a preference but that doesn't mean like

Jordanall women she just like stop wearing makeup if putting on makeup gives her that little boost of confidence and it makes her feel good it makes her feel pretty then you know when you feel

Brian Atlaspretty you you know portray that and you're I'm I'll actually Grant you like all the motivations for why a lot of the motivations for why

Brian Atlaswomen wear makeup for life here just ignore sorry all all the things you listed I I actually don't have any problem with that cool you want to wear makeup cuz you like it that's not I'm more viewing

Brian Atlasit from like the male perspective dating perspective yeah you wear it for whatever Reasons I'm just saying like in a dating perspective I don't think you can make the argument it's not not deceptive and if you can I'm prepared to

Brian Atlashear it uh but then also all the other things I just listed take a swimming swimming in the first date oh my God first date swimming you think that what you think a man

Stacyshould test a Woman by taking her swimming no I mean he should like he can also ask a woman you know can I see you without makeup can I see picture of me without it that's not an ABD question who wants to know if I did to someone

Brian Atlasand they wanted to see a picture of me without makeup we'll leave the makeup one on this is anybody here is anybody here prepared to make the argument that makeup is not deceptive I don't think that makeup has

Pearlto be deceptive I think it can be used as deception I think there's I think there's three different levels one as an art form like just like painting or

Pearlwhatever one you're insecure and you are putting on tons of makeup and contouring the out of your face because you don't like how you look and you don't accept how you look and then the other one is just using it like you were

Pearlsaying to enhance your beauty like it just makes you feel a little bit better I think there are those three different categories that I can think of um I think the one where you are very

Pearlinsecure and you're trying to cover your face is a deeper issue that's coming out in that way and I don't think that that's healthy or beautiful honestly well I mean but the art form

Brian Atlasand the enhancing your beauty I think are totally great well yeah so I do acknowledge that there are women who do makeup as like the art form or whatever but I mean all three are deceptive no I think deceptive would say

StacyI'm not wearing any makeup when you are that's deceptive but if I'm saying yeah I'm wearing a tinted moisturizer and I'm wearing mascara and I'm wearing BL not 20 years ago to makeup now is a whole

Stacylot different there was no contouring there was no I have a bigger nose I know how to Contour it to we in a way to make it look like I have a smaller nose things like that that person is intentionally making their nose smaller for a reason right they're trying to

Stacylook different they're trying to look like someone else in that case I think that is deceptive because 20 years ago if I get a big nose I get a big nose if I'm covering it with makeup that's just something different so the it's the

Jordanintent it's true like you could really go crazy with the makeup like some of the Transformations like the videos that you were playing on like the other podcast where a girl just literally went from like here to here and it's like

Jordannight and day that's pretty deceptive and she's obviously trying to cover up her imperfections and her flaws yeah if you're wearing makeup literally just to enhance and it makes you feel a little

Stacybit better then sure enhance so deception if you have pale skin and you want to bring a little bit of brightness to your skin with a little bit of blush or a little bit of color on your lips that's not deceptive it is deceptive I

Pearljust don't want to look like a you know a COR but even even that's deceptive is it deceptive to put oil in your hair and to make it look shinier like if I put oil on the tips of my hair is that like deceiving you or is that just putting oil in my hair because it's Health like

Pearlit's going to make it healthy and shiny looking well we're not talking about hair we're talking about makeup right but applied that same logic to hair or if I like put fake tan on my body is

Pearlthat are you saying that that's deceptive well I think so uh Yes actually it would be okay well then if if that's how you're if that's how you're like categorizing it I guess

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